Podcast Show Notes
On The Indy Author Podcast, we discuss the writing craft, the publishing voyage, and how we can navigate our way to the readers who will love our books. Click the links below for the show notes for episodes since 200, including summaries and transcripts.
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Episode 292 - Reviving a Series with Greta Boris
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Greta Boris discusses REVIVING A SERIES, including the process authors can use to evaluate what went wrong with the original work; the importance of ensuring that titles, covers, and marketing strategies are brand right; and the specific steps authors can take to improve the books' craft, tighten plots, and align better with genre expectations.
Greta Boris is the USA Today Bestselling author of The Mortician Murders, a humor-filled ghostly mystery series, and The Almost True Crime Stories, a psychological suspense series. She hails from sunny Southern California, where—based on her stories which are all set there—things are darker than you’d expect. She loves coffee, wine-tasting, and dogs but not necessarily in that order.
Episode Links
https://www.facebook.com/greta.boris
Greta’s previous appearances:
Episode 248 - Constructing a Multi-Layered Villain with Greta Boris
Episode 242 - Uncovering Your Author Purpose with Greta Boris and Megan Haskell
Episode 184 - Planning a Novel with Greta Boris and Megan Haskell
Summary
In this episode of The Indy Author Podcast, Matty Dalrymple talks with Greta Boris, USA Today bestselling author of the Mortician Murders and Almost True Crime series, about reviving an old book series. Greta shares her approach and insights into transforming her original series, The Seven Deadly Sins, into a new successful venture, shedding light on her experiences and strategies to breathe new life into her stories.
Greta begins by detailing how her initial series did not achieve the level of success she had hoped for. Despite positive feedback from book clubs, the series failed to capture significant commercial attention. This prompted Boris to re-evaluate and analyze what went wrong, leading her to explore various avenues for rejuvenating the series.
As Greta explains, one of the primary steps in her process was evaluating the craft, marketing, and genre expectations of the original series. She outlines three key areas she examined:
1. Craft and Storytelling Issues: She acknowledges that some of her initial books had draggy spots and unclear motivation for characters, particularly the villains. This can be detrimental to a thriller or suspense series, where pacing and plot coherence are vital.
2. Marketing Missteps: Boris realized that the series title "The Seven Deadly Sins" misled readers, often signaling either horror or romance rather than the intended thriller genre. Moreover, the covers, though attractive, were signaling women's fiction, causing a disconnect with her target audience.
3. Genre Mismatch: The original series struggled with its position in the mystery thriller genre. Greta describes her attempt to align the books more closely with psychological suspense, noting her analysis involved reading bestsellers and award-winning titles in her target genre to identify common elements such as writing style, pacing, and narrative perspective.
Through discussion with her publisher and other authors, Greta decided to pivot the series conceptually by introducing a new overarching theme—framing each book as a season of a true crime podcast hosted by a recurring character. This allowed for a thematic unity that connected the books more cohesively.
The conversation also tackles practical aspects of manuscript revision. Greta elaborated on how the first book in the series required the most extensive rewriting, where she retained only about 30% of the original text. She emphasized the importance of ensuring that the character motivations were clear to avoid confusion and dissatisfaction among readers.
For marketing, Greta capitalized on updated blurbs using tools like ChatGPT to reframe her narrative hooks, ensuring they were punchy and compelling. Additionally, she worked with her publisher to redesign covers that were consistent across the series and aligned better with genre expectations, opting for place-based titles with stylistic similarities to increase visual uniformity and brand recognition.
She mentioned that the revamp proved financially beneficial, noting that the newly launched series has already generated more income than the original series ever did. Although traditional publishing restricts instantaneous sales tracking, Boris found reassurance in indicators such as rights deals for audiobooks and positive reviews on platforms like Goodreads.
Towards the episode's conclusion, Matty and Greta reflect on the dual benefits of revisiting and revamping previous work, emphasizing both the potential financial gains and the satisfaction of elevating storytelling quality. Greta encourages authors to adopt a critical editor's mindset, suggesting that the effort can lead to a more extensive backlist with increased sales potential.
Ultimately, this podcast episode serves as a comprehensive guide for authors looking to reassess their existing series. Greta Boris's experience provides valuable lessons on refining narrative craft, targeting marketing efforts more effectively, and embracing genre conventions to align better with readers' expectations, all while maintaining engagement with an evolving readership.
Episode 290 - The Traveling Writer in Life and on the Page with Luke Richardson
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Luke Richardson discusses THE TRAVELING WRITER IN LIFE AND ON THE PAGE, including how his travels to places like India, Hong Kong, Nepal, and Morocco have inspired his novels, as well as his process for incorporating realistic and vivid settings into his stories. He addresses the challenges writers face when creating stories set in places they haven't visited, shares research resources authors can use for book promotion as well as for writing, and offers best practices for capturing the essence of a location to create an immersive experience for readers.
Luke Richardson is an Amazon bestselling author known for his action-packed thrillers that blend history, adventure, and suspense. Inspired by his travels, he crafts gripping stories that transport readers to exotic locations like Egypt, Hong Kong, and Nepal. His Archaeological Thrillers Series follows Eden Black, as she uncovers ancient secrets and lost legends, while his International Detective books feature Leo Keane & Allissa Stockwell tracking missing persons worldwide. Praised for intricate plots, fast pacing, and vivid storytelling, Luke’s books make readers feel like they’ve traveled the world—without leaving home.
Episode Links
https://www.lukerichardsonauthor.com/
https://www.facebook.com/lukerichardsonauthor/
http://lukerichardsonauthor.com/adventureauthorinsider
Summary
In this episode of The Indy Author Podcast, Matty Dalrymple talks with Amazon bestselling author Luke Richardson about THE TRAVELING WRITER IN LIFE AND ON THE PAGE. Luke is known for his action-packed thrillers that incorporate elements of history, adventure, and suspense. Inspired by his travels, he crafts stories set in exotic locations like Egypt, Hong Kong, and Nepal. In this conversation, they explore the influence of travel on writing, particularly how to depict locations that writers may not have visited personally.
Luke shares his journey of becoming a writer, which began during his first trip outside Europe to India. The overwhelming and vibrant culture of Mumbai inspired him to evoke similar emotions in his readers through his writing. This transformative experience sparked his desire to create stories that provide a sense of travel and adventure to readers.
The discussion explores how authors can write convincingly about foreign locations, even without visiting them. Luke emphasizes that while setting is crucial, the story remains paramount. Authors should focus on capturing the essence and spirit of a place rather than obsessing over every detail. He recalls instances when movies portray London inaccurately, stressing the importance of maintaining the story’s flow over exact geographical accuracy.
For those who can't visit a location, Luke suggests leveraging online resources like Google Maps, YouTube videos, and podcasts to gather information and gain a sense of the environment. Matty and Luke discuss the challenges of capturing sensory details, such as sounds and smells, which enhance the authenticity of a scene. Luke advises listening to podcasts and watching street-level videos for auditory experience and suggests visiting cultural hubs or neighborhoods to grasp the atmosphere and nuances of a particular location.
Another vital aspect discussed is writing authentic characters and understanding cultural differences. Luke illustrates this by mentioning how family structures vary worldwide and how these differences can enrich character development. He advises focusing on universal human experiences like family to create relatable characters, regardless of cultural backgrounds.
Luke also highlights the importance of incorporating feedback from locals or those familiar with the setting to avoid inaccuracies and stereotypes. This step helps ensure cultural representation is both respectful and believable. Matty shares her practice of giving fictional names to real-life locations to avoid being strictly tied to specific geographical accuracies.
Throughout the podcast, Luke shares how his personal travel experiences have influenced his stories, stressing that inspiration can come from both far-flung locales and nearby settings. He encourages writers to keep an open mind while exploring, as even mundane environments can provide compelling story ideas.
Matty and Luke underscore the idea that writers can find exotic elements in their local surroundings, proving that inspiration is all around us. Luke concludes by mentioning his approach to travel: exploring with curiosity and letting creativity take shape from new experiences, ensuring his stories captivate readers by transporting them to different parts of the world.
In summary, this podcast episode provides insightful guidance for authors on how to effectively write about locations they have not visited. By using online tools, focusing on sensory details, and acknowledging cultural nuances, writers can create immersive and authentic stories. Luke Richardson’s experience offers valuable lessons for authors seeking to broaden their narrative horizons and bring far-away places into their storytelling.
Episode 289 - Crafting Poetic Prose with Ran Walker
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Ran Walker discusses CRAFTING POETIC PROSE, including the nuanced art of using poetic devices in fiction to bring language to life, venturing into various literary techniques, including metaphor and simile, personification, symbolism, homonyms, homophones, and homographs, and onomatopoeia, and exploring how these elements can enrich narratives and engage readers in more profound ways.
Ran Walker is an award-winning author of 38 books. He is an associate professor of creative writing at Hampton University and teaches with Writer's Digest University. He lives in Virginia with his wife, daughter, and puppy.
Episode Links
Episode 098 - Redefining Indy Success through Short Fiction with Ran Walker
Summary
In this episode of The Indy Author Podcast, Matty Dalrymple talks with Ran Walker about the nuanced art of using poetic devices in fiction to bring language to life, venturing into various literary techniques, including metaphor and simile, personification, symbolism, homonyms, homophones, and homographs, and onomatopoeia, and exploring how these elements can enrich narratives and engage readers in more profound ways.
The conversation kicks off with a discussion about metaphors and similes, starting with their basic definitions and distinctions. Ran explains that while both compare two things, a metaphor is a stronger assertion of similarity ('He was a beast'), while a simile relies on 'like' or 'as' ('He was like a beast'), which suggests a weaker or partial resemblance. He advises fiction writers to consider how strongly they want their comparisons to resonate and choose accordingly.
Matty then inquires about ensuring the metaphors and similes chosen serve the story rather than distract from it. Ran advises that if a metaphor or simile takes readers out of the narrative, it might be too much. For humorous contexts, however, a bolder metaphor might work when it's intended to pause the narrative momentarily for comedic relief.
Conversation transitions into the poetic devices of personification and its variant, anthropomorphism. Ran describes personification as a way to make inanimate settings more vibrant, painting scenes where "the rocking chair moaned" or "the light from the lamp leaped up the wall." It's a strategy to maintain reader interest during scene descriptions. To find these opportunities, Ran suggests writers draft scenes naturally and, during edits, pinpoint subjects in sentences that could use an imaginative touch of personification.
On symbolism, Ran reflects on how writers often unintentionally create repeating symbols and motifs, such as rings in a narrative to denote never-ending cycles. Once identified, authors can weave these symbols more deliberately into their stories, adding layers of meaning without overtly drawing attention to them.
They also delve into the use of homophones, homonyms, and homographs, where the similarity or identicality in words’ sounds, spellings, or meanings (like 'bear' the animal and 'bear' as in tolerate) can open avenues for linguistic playfulness. Ran shares how these can enrich a text when used sparingly and effectively, enhancing the work's texture by creating intentional echoes or exploring double meanings in context.
The discussion naturally extends to one of Matty's favorites — the concept of onomatopoeia — where words imitate natural sounds within narrative descriptions. Ran warns against excessive use, as seen in comics, but acknowledges that the right application can indeed evoke strong reader reactions.
Throughout, both Matty and Ran emphasize subtlety and intention behind employing literary devices. They remind authors that while different styles can make writing unique, clarity and enhancement of the story should always remain at their core. It's about enriching narrative language in ways that are thoughtful and deliberate, allowing readers enough room to draw meanings deeper than what’s presented on the surface.
Concluding with takeaways, Matty and Ran stress the importance of experimenting with these techniques to elevate writing, recommending that authors engage readers' senses and imagination without detracting from the storytelling.
This podcast episode serves as a valuable resource for writers seeking to enhance their craft through poetic devices. It underlines the power of language choices in narrative construction, the depth symbolic threads can contribute, and the pleasure found in the playful interaction between language and meaning. Through their conversation, aspiring authors gain insightful guidance on striking an effective balance between creativity and coherence in storytelling.
Episode 288 - Decoding Storytelling Tropes with Jennifer Hilt
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Jennifer Hilt discusses DECODING STORYTELLING TROPES, including the universality of about 40 tropes that cross various genres, especially the tropes of found family, misdirection, secrets and scars, and the ticking time bomb. Jennifer shares insights about how tropes like these help shape narratives and character motivations, touching on examples from popular books and movies.
Jennifer Hilt is a USA Today Bestselling author and the creator of The Trope Thesaurus: An Author Resource, a five-book series beloved by writers seeking to hone their craft. With a diverse portfolio spanning twenty-four books under four pen names, she has also authored the urban fantasy trilogy The Undead Detective. As a professional plotter and concept creator, Jennifer has helped countless writers develop unforgettable stories. Holding degrees in linguistics and literature, Jennifer loves collecting obscure dictionaries, binge-watching Scandi-noir series, and shouting out tropes from her couch.
Episode Links
https://jenniferhilt.substack.com/
https://www.youtube.com/@TropeTalk
https://www.facebook.com/jennifer.hilt
Episode 140 - Troping Your Way to a Stronger Story with Jennifer Hilt
Summary
In this episode of The Indy Author Podcast, Matty Dalrymple talks with Jennifer Hilt about the role of tropes in writing, particularly within the mystery and thriller genres. They explore how these storytelling elements can transcend genres and enhance narrative depth and reader engagement.
The conversation kicks off with Jennifer discussing her love for open-water swimming, drawing parallels between the vastness of the ocean and the feeling of being a small part of a much larger world. This sense of exploration and stepping outside one's comfort zone seamlessly transitions into the exploration of narrative tropes, which provide a framework for storytelling across various genres.
Jennifer emphasizes that tropes are not genre-specific but rather universal storytelling mechanisms that can be applied creatively across different genres. She highlights around 40 tropes, suggesting that these can be mixed and matched depending on the story's needs. In particular, she notes how mystery and thriller tropes share commonalities with those in other genres, such as romance, sci-fi, and general fiction. The key is in how these tropes are paired with genre expectations to achieve unique storytelling outcomes.
A significant portion of the discussion centers on the popularity of the domestic thriller market, highlighting examples like Frida McFadden's "The Housemaid." Jennifer explains how this genre has embraced simple yet impactful storylines involving a limited number of characters. The domestic thriller's appeal lies in its ability to combine the familiar with high-tension narrative elements, often exploring themes like found family and the darker undercurrents of seemingly ordinary lives.
The concept of misdirection—a staple in mystery and thriller narratives—is dissected in the context of its broader applicability. Jennifer and Matty discuss how misdirection can enrich character development and plot twists in any genre, using examples like Jane Austen's "Pride and Prejudice" and the film "Knives Out" to illustrate its versatility. Misdirection, they note, is about guiding the audience's perception and strategically revealing hidden truths, which can lead to compelling and engaging storytelling.
Similarly, the "secrets and scars" trope is examined for its potential to drive character motivation and conflict. Jennifer points out that both secrets (hidden information) and scars (past traumas) serve as powerful narrative devices. They can provide depth to characters by showcasing their vulnerabilities and the lengths they go to to protect themselves. For instance, the emotional unraveling depicted in "Gone Girl" vividly illustrates how deeply embedded secrets and scars can propel a storyline.
The conversation also touches on the importance of the "ticking time bomb" trope, which creates urgency and momentum in storytelling. Jennifer shares insights into how even non-thriller genres can benefit from time-sensitive plot elements. By incorporating major life events such as weddings, moves, or job changes, authors can introduce natural deadlines that keep the narrative from stagnating, thus maintaining reader interest.
Lastly, the episode delves into the potential overlap between narrative structure and audience appeal. Matty recounts a personal revelation about her affinity for settings characterized by isolation and seasonal quietude, suggesting that understanding the underlying themes within one's work can help in identifying suitable comparisons for marketing purposes. Recognizing and embracing these recurring themes can offer fresh perspectives and draw in new readers who resonate with those elements.
This episode of The Indy Author Podcast with Jennifer Hilt provides valuable insights into how tropes function as a universal language in storytelling. By exploring their application, whether it's through the lens of mystery, thriller, or any other genre, authors can enhance their narratives, create engaging twists, and ultimately connect more deeply with their readers.
Episode 287 - Managing Your Editorial Crew with Roz Morris
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Roz Morris discusses MANAGING YOUR EDITORIAL CREW, including how authors can effectively manage their editing process, the role beta readers play in the development of an author's work, what the needs are for editing before submitting a work to a traditional publisher or an agent, and tips for indie authors on making the most out of their editing experiences and dollars.
Roz Morris’s novels and memoir have been recognized by major mainstream awards. She’s coached award-winning writers in both fiction and non-fiction, taught creative writing for The Guardian masterclasses, blogged for Writers & Artists Yearbook, and been a regular judge on Litopia’s Pop-Up Submissions show, critiquing manuscripts from promising writers. Roz is also the Editor-in-Chief of the Alliance of Independent Authors.
Episode Links
https://nailyournovel.wordpress.com/
Episode 247 - Newsletter Marketing as a Creative Endeavor with Roz Morris
Episode 088 - How to Receive and Give Critique with Tiffany Yates Martin
Summary
This week on The Indy Author Podcast, Matty Dalrymple talks with Roz Morris about the evolution of authors' editing needs as their careers progress. They dive into the different types of editing, provide insights into how authors can effectively manage their editing process, and explore the role beta readers play in the development of an author's work. This podcast episode highlights the changing landscape of editing and provides tips for indie authors on making the most out of their editing experiences.
Roz Morris begins by outlining the three general categories of editing: developmental editing, copy editing, and proofreading. Developmental editing focuses on the content of a manuscript, ensuring that it works for its intended audience and fulfills its potential. Following that is copy editing, where inconsistencies and inaccuracies are addressed. The final stage is proofreading, which checks for any remaining minor errors, making the book ready for publication.
Matty explains her approach to editing, describing how she uses a single editor for her novels to identify major issues, focusing primarily on the character's motivations. Additionally, she relies on beta readers to provide insights and feedback that go beyond what's typically covered in a traditional edit. This tailored method has evolved over time, informed by her growing expertise, a network of sophisticated beta readers, and the advancement of editorial tools like Microsoft Word.
Roz discusses the change in editing needs that occurs as authors become more experienced. Early on, comprehensive developmental editing may be essential. However, as authors grow more proficient, they learn what to watch for in their own work and can rely more on beta readers and targeted editorial feedback to address their "blind spots." Roz explains how seasoned writers often transition away from needing extensive developmental edits unless they venture into unfamiliar genres or styles.
A significant point made by both Matty and Roz is the importance of having a network of beta readers that are knowledgeable about the author's specific genre. Beta readers not only help identify issues but can also provide market research by giving feedback on characters, plot elements, and story satisfaction. They caution, however, that authors should carefully weigh beta readers' suggestions and maintain their vision for their work.
Matty shares an anecdote where her editor suggested a change that led her to think deeper about setting and plot possibilities, ultimately enriching the story. Roz emphasizes that effective editors engage in discussions with authors, offering guidance rather than dictating changes. This collaborative process helps authors refine their craft and produce work that aligns with both their artistic vision and market expectations.
Roz and Matty agree that as writers become more practiced, they can better judge what feedback is useful and where they need external help. Matty notes a sophisticated use of tools like AI for organizing thoughts and reaching clarity on plot points before seeking external input.
The conversation shifts towards leveraging beta readers and editors according to their strengths. Matty reveals how she strategically positions her editor within her editing process, taking advantage of different individuals' expertise. They discuss the valuable role that contests with editorial feedback can play in providing impartial insights into one's work.
In the context of traditional publishing, Roz advises against unnecessary copy editing or proofreading before submitting a manuscript, suggesting that the focus should be on developmental improvements instead. The expectation is that publishers and literary agents will undertake their own developmental edits once a manuscript is submitted.
Ending on a reflective note, they discuss when it might be time for an author to seek new editorial relationships. If an author consistently disagrees with their editor’s feedback, it may indicate that they've outgrown that editorial partnership. Roz encourages authors to remain open to collaboration and to continuously assess their editorial needs as they develop their skills and grow their careers.
In summary, this podcast episode provides insightful guidance for indie authors on adapting their editing strategies to match their evolving competencies, highlighting the critical role of both editors and beta readers in an author’s development. It underscores the importance of building a supportive creative team and remaining adaptive in one’s approach to producing compelling, polished narratives.
Episode 285 - Writing Short with Art Taylor
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Art Taylor discusses WRITING SHORT, including common challenges faced by novelists transitioning to short stories. Art emphasizes the importance of economy, efficiency, and focus; shares practical advice on trimming word count while maintaining narrative impact, such as eliminating redundant phrases and opting for active voice; and explores how key elements—like conflict escalation and character development—must be handled differently in short stories.
Art Taylor is the Edgar Award-winning author of two short story collections—The Adventure of the Castle Thief and Other Expeditions and Indiscretions and The Boy Detective & The Summer of ’74 and Other Tales of Suspense—and of the novel in stories On the Road with Del & Louise, winner of the Agatha Award for Best First Novel. He is a professor of English at George Mason University.
Episode Links
https://www.facebook.com/ArtTaylorShortStories
https://www.instagram.com/arttaylorwriter/
https://bsky.app/profile/arttaylorwriter.bsky.social
Episode 212 - What Writers Can Learn from The First Two Pages with Art Taylor
Episode 193 - The Path to Short Story Publication with Michael Bracken
Episode 098 - Redefining Indy Success through Short Fiction with Ran Walker
Summary
This week on The Indy Author Podcast, Matty Dalrymple talks with guest Art Taylor about the intricate art of crafting short stories. Art, an Edgar Award-winning author, provides insightful guidance for writers, especially those accustomed to long-form fiction, who wish to delve into short fiction. The discussion focuses on strategies for creating compelling short stories by emphasizing economy, efficiency, and focus.
Art begins the conversation by reflecting on the common struggle many novelists face when writing short stories. He shares anecdotes from his own experiences and from those of colleagues in the writing community. Art explains that the challenge often lies in adapting to a smaller "canvas." Whereas novels allow for elaborate character development and expansive subplots, short stories demand brevity and concentration on a singular narrative arc. He also notes that while characters in short stories can be as rich as those in novels, achieving this requires a different approach.
Delving deeper into the essence of short story craft, Art highlights three critical principles: economy, efficiency, and focus. He defines focus as maintaining a singular narrative arc without diverging into unnecessary subplots, and economy as ensuring every element in the story has a purpose. Efficiency, on the other hand, involves ensuring that every component of the story fulfills multiple functions. For instance, a piece of dialogue should not only advance the plot but also reveal character traits and enhance the story's atmosphere.
Art also shares practical exercises to help writers condense their work. He describes a classroom exercise where students are tasked with composing a six-sentence story to outline the core elements: character, desire, action, conflict, climax, and resolution. This exercise forces writers to distill the essence and framework of their narrative, whether they're just beginning a short story or refining an existing draft.
He further discusses the concept of an "armature" in short story writing—an idea borrowed from sculpture. Just as a sculptor begins with a skeletal framework to support their creation, a writer should identify the core structure of their story. Art introduces a six-sentence breakdown of "The Speckled Band" by Arthur Conan Doyle, demonstrating an example of how to incorporate layered plots and suspense within a concise format.
Throughout the episode, Art offers several strategic trimming tips. He advises writers to escalate conflicts rather than repeat them, and to be mindful of pacing and rhythm. He suggests using dialogue to create a natural ebb and flow, providing necessary pauses for the reader to reflect. Additionally, he warns against excessive density in writing, which can exhaust the reader, and emphasizes the importance of finding a balance that keeps the reader engaged.
Art and Matty explore potential pitfalls for writers transitioning from long-form to short-form fiction. Art warns against creating vignettes—beautifully descriptive but narratively shallow—and encourages writers to ensure their stories include a complete arc with a clear conflict and resolution. He suggests writers use feedback from others to gauge where their story might lag or require more development.
In discussing the technical aspects, Art recommends writing with clarity and precision by eliminating unnecessary qualifiers and avoiding passive voice unless strategically used.
Overall, this podcast episode provides a comprehensive discussion on the nuances of short story writing. By offering detailed methodologies, illustrative examples, and helpful exercises, Matty and Art successfully guide long-form writers through the transition to mastering short fiction. Aspiring writers and seasoned authors alike can gain valuable insights into the art of distilling expansive ideas into powerful short stories.
Episode 284 - Training the Brain for Fiction Dictation with Sarah Elisabeth Sawyer
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Sarah Elisabeth Sawyer discusses TRAINING THE BRAIN FOR FICTION DICTATION, including the differences in approach for fiction versus nonfiction. Sarah describes the challenges authors face when transitioning to dictating fiction and offers practical advice for overcoming mental blocks. Sarah also highlights the flexibility of dictation, allowing authors to work in different environments and in shorter time blocks. And she discusses how dictation can improve other audio assets and can engage audiences in new ways.
Sarah Elisabeth Sawyer is an author and writing instructor who takes authors struggling to master the tools and knowledge of their author journey and helps them become confident in writing their books. She has been featured on Joanna Penn’s The Creative Penn podcast, Jane Friedman’s blog, Writer’s Digest magazine, and more. She’s published 19 books, 11 of which she wrote solely by dictation. Sarah is also host of The Confident Fiction Author podcast which empowers authors to live their best creative lifestyle. Her Fictation Digital Course takes authors through the exact process of mastering dictation to write fiction.
Episode Links
www.fictioncourses.com
https://www.facebook.com/fictioncourses
Explore Sarah's fiction dictation course via my affiliate link: https://theindyauthor--fictioncourses.thrivecart.com/fictation/
Summary
This week on The Indy Author Podcast, Matty Dalrymple talks with Sarah Elisabeth Sawyer about the art of dictation for authors. Sarah, an established author and writing instructor, emphasizes the distinct skills required for dictating fiction versus nonfiction. She shares insights for authors looking to delve into dictation or improve their current practices, highlighting practical tips and overcoming mental barriers associated with this method.
Sarah explains that many authors are used to dictating emails or text messages but find themselves struggling when transitioning to dictating fiction. The mental shift involves creating new neural pathways, which she describes as a different skill set from nonfiction dictation. Authors must train their minds to verbalize fictional characters and worlds, which can initially seem daunting. Sarah recounts her own journey of overcoming these barriers and the eventual success and confidence she gained from becoming adept in dictating fiction.
For those getting started, Sarah advises joining communities of authors who are mastering dictation, reading published fiction out loud to practice using dictation technology, and vocalizing punctuation to improve accuracy. Practicing speaking one's fiction out loud allows authors to become accustomed to hearing their own voices telling the story, which can help bridge the gap to full-fledged dictation. She reassures authors that while moving from typing to dictating might be gradual, it's possible to become as comfortable with dictating as they are with typing.
Matty raises a point about storytelling speed, noting that many authors pursue dictation to capture thoughts faster than typing allows. In response, Sarah shares how dictation can benefit authors beyond speed, such as accommodating health issues or offering flexibility to dictate in various environments like walking or doing household chores.
The discussion also delves into technological solutions for dictation. Matty expresses a desire for voice-activated recording when driving or walking, which would enhance hands-free dictation. While Sarah has yet to find a perfect app, she suggests setups where phones are mounted for safe hands-free operation and encourages experimentation with different tools and approaches.
For Sarah, the editing phase after dictation involves a crucial cleanup step where potential transcription errors are addressed, ensuring the draft is as clean as a typical typed one. This process allows authors to focus on storytelling without being hindered by transcription inaccuracies during subsequent editing.
Sarah also touches on preserving author voice in dictated works, sharing that her oral storytelling background contributed greatly to maintaining her distinct style. Authors looking to safeguard their voice might consider storytelling practices, such as engaging with live audiences or recording narrative videos, to integrate oral storytelling into their writing habits.
For those already experienced in dictation, Sarah suggests trying new methods or tools to enhance efficiency and enjoyment. Exploring various environments and embracing new technologies can refresh the dictation experience, making writing more dynamic and productive.
The episode concludes with Sarah providing resources for authors interested in dictation, including a quick start guide and a comprehensive training bootcamp via her website. These resources aim to help authors at any stage of their dictation journey discover a smoother, more efficient writing process.
In summary, Matty and Sarah's conversation sheds light on dictation as a valuable tool for authors. By addressing mental barriers, exploring technological options, and providing actionable advice, they offer insights into how authors can incorporate dictation into their creative processes, improving not just speed but overall storytelling flexibility and health.
Episode 273 - Showrunning Your Series Novels with Cheryl McKay
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Cheryl McKay discusses SHOWRUNNING YOUR SERIES NOVELS, including how to plan for standalone versus series formats; the role of episodic elements; the benefits of feeling inspired by and using real-world locations in storytelling; the importance of character development and story arcs; and the importance of making strong standalone stories with potential for growth or spinoffs. We also discuss the responsibilities of a showrunner and how this role parallels the varied duties of an indie author.
CHERYL MCKAY been professionally writing since 1997. Before creating, showrunning, and executive producing the multi-award-winning Season One of These Stones, Cheryl wrote the screenplay for The Ultimate Gift. Cheryl co-wrote the faith-based feature films, Indivisible and Extraordinary, as well as multiple children’s projects, including five episodes of Superbook and forty episodes of the audio drama, The Wild & Wacky Totally True Bible Stories with Frank Peretti. In addition to film and television, Cheryl has enjoyed penning novels like Song of Springhill and the award-winning Never the Bride (with Rene Gutteridge), as well as nonfiction books.
Episode Links
www.purplepenworks.com
https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100027726262011
https://www.instagram.com/cherylmckayscreenwriter/
https://www.youtube.com/@thesestones
Summary
This week on The Indy Author Podcast, Matty Dalrymple talks with Cheryl McKay about the valuable lessons series novelists can draw from TV series. The conversation delves into structuring series narratives, incorporating cliffhangers, and planning for both standalone and ongoing stories.
Matty opens the discussion by highlighting the initial challenge for authors deciding between writing a standalone book or a series. Speaking from her experience, Cheryl notes that this dilemma is paralleled in the screenwriting world, where screenwriters often face the decision of whether their work fits better as a standalone movie or an expanding series. Cheryl shares an anecdote about transforming her screenplay, "Never the Bride," initially intended as a standalone, into a series. She draws a parallel to the "Bruce Almighty" series, where a strong character in the first movie inspired the subsequent "Evan Almighty."
Cheryl emphasizes the importance of planning for character and story arcs that can expand beyond the first instance of work. She suggests series writers consider ongoing character development and multiple storylines that can extend through several books or episodes. Cheryl’s insights highlight how detailed planning, like creating a "show bible," is crucial in ensuring consistency and depth in storytelling. This planning aids in setting rules for the world, creating characters with scalable arcs, and contemplating potential storylines.
Matty and Cheryl explore the concept of resolving narratives versus leaving doors open for future installments. Cheryl explains the strategic balance between offering enough closure in a story to satisfy the audience while leaving threads that entice them to come back for more. They discuss the fact that readers are often wary of starting an unfinished series, emphasizing the need for authors to ensure that their first book is strong enough to stand alone while setting up potential sequels.
Cheryl also underscores the differing freedoms and constraints faced by indie authors versus screenwriters in traditional TV. Where screenwriters often hand over control post-script and might face rushed story completions due to network decisions, indie authors generally maintain creative control, deciding the length and arcs of their series based on interest and sales. This leads to a discussion of audience influence on storytelling. Matty mentions how direct feedback from readers allows indie authors to adjust future installments, a luxury less available to screenwriters.
The role of guest characters in series is another area of discussion. Cheryl explains how "guest stars" can enrich TV shows and novels alike, offering fresh stories and conflicts. These characters may appear in specific episodes or books but can evolve into recurring roles or even inspire spin-offs. Cheryl illustrates this with an example of a crime series writer whose secondary characters or unique professions may spawn their own narratives.
Exploring spin-offs, Cheryl suggests leveraging interesting side characters to explore new stories, much like the transition from "Bruce Almighty" to "Evan Almighty." The adaptation of characters into different tones or genres can attract different audiences, though maintaining the original's spirit can be challenging. Cheryl remarks that changing a story's tone, as seen in "Evan Almighty," can surprise audiences, and creators should tread carefully when altering the formula of a beloved concept.
The conversation wraps up with insights into the multifaceted role of a showrunner in TV production, akin to an indie author’s balancing act of writing, marketing, and overseeing book production. Cheryl describes how a showrunner manages the creative vision, casting, and logistics, emphasizing the importance of collaboration and communication akin to an indie author's need to manage various aspects of book publication.
Matty draws parallels between a showrunner’s operational overview and an indie author's need to manage the entire writing-to-publishing process, encouraging authors to take a holistic approach to their craft. Cheryl’s experiences highlight the similarities between TV production and indie publishing, offering authors insights into effectively managing their series and maintaining engagement with their audience.
Episode 272 - The Evolving Author and Second Editions with Joanna Penn
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Joanna Penn discusses THE EVOLVING AUTHOR AND SECOND EDITIONS, including the release of the second edition of Joanna's book, HOW TO WRITE NON-FICTION. Joanna discusses the changes in nonfiction writing, including the importance of storytelling, which led her to apply some of the personal elements and insights she has used in her memoir works into this new edition. We delve into the challenges and benefits of putting out a new edition versus updating the existing one, the evolving landscape of self-publishing, and the impact of new technologies on the writing business.
Joanna Penn writes non-fiction for authors and is an award-winning, New York Times and USA Today bestselling author of thrillers, dark fantasy, and memoir as J.F. Penn. She’s also an award-winning podcaster of The Creative Penn Podcast, a creative entrepreneur, and an international professional speaker.
Episode Links
www.TheCreativePenn.com
https://x.com/thecreativepenn
Episode 054 - Futurist Trends We Can Prepare for Now with Joanna Penn
Summary
This week on The Indy Author Podcast, Matty Dalrymple talks with Joanna Penn about the evolution of Joanna’s book, "How to Write Nonfiction," as it moves into its second edition. They delve into the shifts in nonfiction writing, driven by both personal growth and technological changes.
Joanna highlights how the personal touch in nonfiction writing has become more critical as AI can generate standard content. She shares that her own experiences, particularly writing a memoir, have significantly altered her approach to nonfiction. This emphasizes the need for personal stories and emotions in nonfiction, transforming it into a more humanized and relatable genre.
The conversation uncovers the restructuring of Joanna's book, including the blending of topics like publishing, marketing, and business into a cohesive unit. This decision reflects changes in the publishing landscape and her own creative evolution, moving towards a more evergreen approach.
Matty and Joanna discuss the pros and cons of revising existing books versus writing new content. Joanna points out the critical balance between updating books for factual correctness and maintaining voice authenticity. She says that a new edition can sometimes feel like an entirely different book, requiring new ISBNs and marketing strategies. However, she acknowledges that it's essential for such revisions to represent genuine shifts in perspective or content to be worthwhile.
In aligning with the theme of nonfiction's evolution, Joanna and Matty explore the role of storytelling in nonfiction writing, such as the incorporation of personal anecdotes and experiences. Joanna stresses the importance of this blending of factual writing with personal narrative to ensure nonfiction books remain engaging amidst the rise of AI-generated content.
Another significant discussion point is the future of audiobooks and AI. Joanna covers how AI could revolutionize audiobook production, making it more accessible and diverse in language and accent. This innovation could significantly lower costs and broaden market reach for authors, enabling them to share their work without language barriers. Matty adds to this by discussing her aspirations to use AI-generated voices trained on her own, providing a consistent and customized reading experience across different languages and works.
Throughout the episode, Matty and Joanna also touch upon the shifting landscape of author platforms and content. They consider the evolving utility of platforms like Medium and Substack and the enduring value of owning one’s platform. This discussion brings forth the idea of not building on rented land and the safety of keeping control over content and audience interaction.
Joanna shares her stance on various publishing formats, emphasizing selling directly to readers as a more lucrative and controlled option for authors. This ties into the broader theme of how technological shifts are impacting author strategies and book marketing efforts.
Episode 271 - Tapping into Your Author Voice with Tiffany Yates Martin
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Tiffany Yates Martin discusses TAPPING INTO YOUR AUTHOR VOICE, including how many writers mistakenly view voice as an external element they need to find or impose on their work. Instead, she believes that true voice comes from genuinely accessing and expressing one's internal truths, a process that can feel quite daunting. Tiffany emphasizes that an authentic voice is not about adopting a façade but rather about tapping into what is true to the author and allowing it to emerge naturally in their writing.
Tiffany Yates Martin has spent nearly thirty years as an editor in the publishing industry, working with major publishers and New York Times, Washington Post, Wall Street Journal, and USA Today bestselling and award-winning authors as well as indie and newer writers. She is the founder of FoxPrint Editorial (named one of Writer’s Digest’s Best Websites for Authors) and author of Intuitive Editing: A Creative and Practical Guide to Revising Your Writing and the recently released The Intuitive Author: How to Grow & Sustain a Happier Writing Career. She is a regular contributor to writers’ outlets like Writer’s Digest, Jane Friedman, and Writer Unboxed, and a frequent presenter and keynote speaker for writers’ organizations around the country. Under her pen name, Phoebe Fox, she is the author of six novels.
Episode Links
https://www.foxprinteditorial.com
https://www.instagram.com/tiffanyyatesmartin/
https://www.facebook.com/tiffanynyates/
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCJ-TMebXV5sg8-fQkVeg_0w
Summary
This week on The Indy Author Podcast, Matty Dalrymple talks with Tiffany Yates Martin about the concept of "voice" in writing and how authors can authentically express their unique perspectives. Tiffany challenges the common perception among authors that voice is something external—a façade to be layered over their work. Instead, she proposes that true voice emerges when writers draw from within themselves, accessing their internal truths and allowing these to infuse their narratives.
One of the primary topics Tiffany tackles is the misconception that voice needs to be consciously tacked onto a piece of writing. She believes this approach can hinder creativity and authenticity. Voice, according to Tiffany, should not be imposed but instead arise naturally from the writer's own experiences, emotions, and perspectives. This process of letting one's true voice guide the writing can be intimidating for many authors, as it requires vulnerability and honesty. It’s about stripping away the layers of pretense and showing raw, genuine aspects of oneself.
Throughout the episode, Tiffany emphasizes the importance of embracing one's individuality in writing. By doing so, writers can create more compelling and relatable stories that resonate with readers on a deeper level. This inward search for authenticity not only enhances the quality of the work but also connects more powerfully with the audience.
In support of her insights, Tiffany shares key examples and strategies that authors can use to discover and refine their voice. While the process can be challenging, it is ultimately rewarding, leading to a more fulfilling writing experience and richer, more authentic stories.
The discussion offers valuable takeaways for writers at any stage in their careers. It encourages them to reflect on their personal truths and how these can be a wellspring of creative material. By courageously accessing and expressing their inner selves, authors can develop a distinctive voice that stands out in the literary world.
Episode 268 - What Authors Should Not Learn from Movies with Rene Gutteridge
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Rene Gutteridge discusses WHAT AUTHORS SHOULD NOT LEARN FROM MOVIES, including
how crucial point of view and inner monologue are in novel writing compared to the visual storytelling required in movies; how writers can mistakenly adopt a 'director's' approach, leading to overly descriptive and less engaging prose; and delve the science behind the different brain functions of hobbyist writers versus professional authors. We touch on how conciseness in movies contrasts with the depth needed in novels, using examples like Dennis Lehane’s MYSTIC RIVER, and discuss practical strategies for maintaining engaging pacing in fiction without losing substance.
Rene Gutteridge is the multi-genre author of 24 novels plus several non-fiction titles. Her indie film SKID won deadCenter’s Best Oklahoma Feature in 2015, and her novel MY LIFE AS A DOORMAT was adapted into the Hallmark movie LOVE’S COMPLICATED. She is co-writer on the feature film FAMILY CAMP, a Movieguide award winner and a Dove Award nominee for 2023. She is also a Screencraft finalist in true crime. Rene is co-director of WriterCon in Oklahoma City, senior contributor at Writing Momentum, and the head writer at Skit Guys Studios.
Episode Links
https://www.renegutteridge.com
https://www.facebook.com/ReneGutteridgeAuthor
Episode 253 - Navigating the Worlds of Fiction and Film with Rene Gutteridge
Summary
This week on The Indy Author Podcast, Matty Dalrymple talks with returning guest Rene Gutteridge about the intricate relationship between writing fiction and the art of filmmaking, and how writers can effectively leverage these insights. The conversation delves deep into the various differences between storytelling in novels and films, and what authors can potentially learn—or, crucially, avoid learning—from movies when crafting their stories.
Rene discusses the tendency of writers to “direct” characters in novels as they might in a film. She advises against this, emphasizing that writing should not merely mimic movies because, while films focus more on what can be visually and briskly presented, novel writing thrives in its ability to explore the inner thoughts and perceptions of characters. She highlights a key point: “If you could take that chapter and go set up a movie camera and film it as is, you're not nailing it.” Rene shares an example of “directing” a character unnecessarily by describing mundane actions like making coffee without adding emotional or motivational subtext.
A notable aspect of their discussion is the scientific study Rene cites, comparing the brain activities of new versus professional writers when they write. The study found that experienced writers activated the speech part of the brain, emphasizing writing from a character’s internal point of view rather than an external, visual one. This distinction helps inform Rene’s belief that writing, even in third person, should delve deeply into a character’s psyche to resonate with readers on a more profound level.
In discussing the challenges and methods of effectively writing in deep point of view, Rene illustrates how characters perceive the world based on past experiences, profession, age, and other factors. She explains how these elements layer to form a character's perspective, providing depth that cannot be fully captured by the visual-centric storytelling of movies.
Matty and Rene also explore the structural dynamics between first-person and third-person narration. They discuss how each style affects the depth of storytelling and how to experiment with these narrative structures to enhance a story. Rene shares her own challenges with first-person narration, indicating that while it can produce compelling characters, it is often more challenging and less flexible than third-person narration.
Rene dives into the pitfalls of adapting novels into screenplays, highlighting the complications of translating intricate inner dialogues and background details into visual scenes. They touch on the example of Clint Eastwood's adaptation of “Mystic River” as an illustration of how films condense what novels elaborate, sometimes sacrificing depth for pacing.
Rene provides thoughtful insights into how characters can hold their own through compelling voices, regardless of the point-of-view choice. They delve into how authors can learn from cinematic techniques in terms of pacing and economy while ensuring these methods serve rather than hinder the depth and relatability of the written word.
In concluding the episode, both Matty and Rene reflect on the crucial aspect of intentionality in writing. Everything on the page should intentionally contribute to character development and plot progression—that's how readers become invested.
Episode 267 - Using Romance to Write Stories with Heart with Jennifer Probst
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Jennifer Probst discusses USING ROMANCE TO WRITE STORIES WITH HEART, including the importance of emotional depth, character growth arcs, and the role of secondary characters in enhancing romantic storylines. Jennifer emphasizes the need for sexual tension and matching the type of romance with different characters to create compelling narratives. She also dives into techniques for balancing varying levels of romantic steam in different genres, the importance of human connection, and the subtleties of using vulnerabilities in characters to enrich stories.
Jennifer Probst wrote her first book at twelve years old. She bound it in a folder, read it to her classmates, and hasn’t stopped writing since. She holds a masters in English Literature and lives in the beautiful Hudson Valley in upstate New York. She is the New York Times, USA Today, and Wall Street Journal bestselling author of over fifty books in contemporary romance fiction. She was thrilled her book, The Marriage Bargain, spent 26 weeks on the New York Times. Her work has been translated in over a dozen countries, sold over a million copies, and was dubbed a “romance phenom” by Kirkus Reviews.
Episode Links
https://www.jenniferprobst.com
https://www.tiktok.com/@authorjenniferprobst
https://www.instagram.com/authorjenniferprobst/
https://www.facebook.com/jenniferprobst.authorpage
Summary
This week on The Indy Author Podcast, Matty Dalrymple talks with bestselling author Jennifer Probst about effectively incorporating romance into your writing. The conversation provides valuable insights into how authors can integrate love stories into their narratives, regardless of genre, enhancing the depth and engagement of their characters and plots.
Understanding Romance and Spectrum
Matty opens the discussion by distinguishing between romance's different levels, from sweet to steamy. Jennifer emphasizes that the "steam level" depends entirely on the story's needs and target audience, highlighting her experience writing across different niches and heat levels. In her words, "a romance is a happy ever after ending, between two characters," but it can also encompass broader love stories, from romantic suspense to relationships with pets.
Using Emotion to Drive Connection
Jennifer discusses the critical role of emotion in storytelling, whether it's navigating grief, love, or fear. For her, developing authentic characters with whom readers can empathize is essential. She states, "Emotion is one of the most important things in a story because...you feel a connection." This human connection is what keeps readers engaged, as they root for characters' growth and emotional journeys.
Secondary Characters: Adding Depth to Romance
Secondary characters can enrich a story by offering contrast, humor, or different kinds of relationships. Jennifer shares anecdotes about unexpected secondary characters who have captivated her readers' and her own imaginations, citing examples of a grumpy neighbor or a challenging animal who becomes a beloved friend. These characters can add vibrancy and unexpected layers to the main narrative, creating opportunities for secondary romances or other forms of love.
The Art of Sensual Tension
Building suspense in romance, whether through witty banter or unresolved attraction, is a favorite tool for Jennifer. By creating scenarios of will-they-or-won't-they, writers can maintain reader interest throughout a narrative. She describes scenarios from friends to lovers and forced proximity as rich grounds for romance, offering examples from classic TV shows like "Moonlighting" and "Friends" where the tension between characters was central to the audience's engagement.
Growth Arcs: Essential for Character Development
Jennifer stresses the importance of growth arcs for both the individual characters and their relationships. She outlines how a well-constructed arc involves characters changing from their introduction to the story’s conclusion, highlighting the significance of characters overcoming personal struggles and achieving growth. This development adds depth to romance narratives and ensures satisfying conclusions for readers.
Matching the Romance to the Characters
Finally, Jennifer talks about how the type and style of romance should align with her characters’ personalities. Characters often dictate the level of romance in her stories, from the edgy romances of rough-around-the-edges heroes to sweeter, simpler tales of bakers and small-town characters. She advises authors to remain sensitive to how their characters evolve, allowing authentic and convincing romantic dynamics to unfold naturally in the narrative.
Conclusion: Tailoring Romance to Enhance Your Story
In this podcast episode, Matty Dalrymple and Jennifer Probst delve into the intricacies of writing romance that resonates with readers. They explore how emotion, character development, and thoughtfully crafted romance arcs can make narratives more compelling and relatable. Authors are encouraged to let character personalities guide the romantic elements of their stories while ensuring reader expectations are met regarding tone and content.
Episode 266 - Timeless Storytelling Principles with Douglas Vigliotti
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Douglas Vigliotti discusses TIMELESS STORYTELLING PRINCIPLES, including the significance of consistency, reversals, and recognitions in novels, drawing parallels to mediums like film. Doug explores the role of believability and logic in creating compelling stories and reflects on the impact of marketing pressures on current narratives. He also discusses the cyclical nature of transgressive art.
Douglas Vigliotti is the author of four books, including ARISTOTLE FOR NOVELISTS and TOM COLLINS: A ‘SLIGHTLY CROOKED’ NOVEL, which is available to listen to on SLIGHTLY CROOKED: GOOD STORIES,TOLD WELL, a podcast that also features his raw and unorthodox poem collection MINI HEARTBREAKS (OR, LITTLE POEMS ABOUT LIFE). He is also the host of BOOKS FOR MEN, a weekly podcast to inspire (more) men to read. He lives in New Haven, Connecticut.
Episode Links
https://douglasvigliotti.com/
https://www.instagram.com/douglasvigliotti/
Summary
This week on The Indy Author Podcast, Matty Dalrymple talks with Douglas Vigliotti about his book "Aristotle for Novelists: 14 Timeless Principles on the Art of Story." The discussion delves into Aristotle's enduring influence on storytelling and how these ancient principles can guide contemporary novelists in crafting compelling narratives.
Douglas Vigliotti explains his journey from writing nonfiction to fiction and why he turned to Aristotle's "Poetics" to enhance his storytelling skills. He recounts how he identified that understanding story and character development was pivotal in moving from writing to truly connecting with readers.
One major theme explored is the principle of consistency in novels. Douglas emphasizes that consistency doesn't mean each chapter should mirror the next, but rather that the style, structure, and character portrayal remain coherent throughout. This, he believes, is fundamental to maintaining a reader's engagement and ensuring the story's integrity. He illustrates this with examples from literature and screenwriting, noting how differing styles or even disruptive styles can work—as long as they're executed consistently.
The podcast also tackles the principle of "show, don't tell," crucial advice for writers. Douglas reflects on storytelling as an imitation of action, a concept rooted in Aristotle's belief in learning through imitation. He argues that action reveals more than words, both in life and in storytelling. A character's journey and growth are fully realized through their deeds, not just their dialogue or thoughts.
Matty and Douglas also explore the cyclical nature of art and how transgressive works, like those from the era of "Fight Club," are less common today due to external pressures and censorship. Yet Douglas remains positive that art will push boundaries again, as this cyclical nature tends to repeat itself.
The principle of logic and believability in storytelling is dissected further. Douglas discusses the chain of causality and how a story should unfold through a logical sequence of cause and effect. Believability is paramount, he argues, for a narrative's success, no matter if it’s within a fantastical or realistic setting. Adhering to the world and rules that writers create is essential for maintaining a reader's trust and interest.
The conversation turns toward techniques of storytelling efficiency often showcased in films. Douglas praises films for their lean and essential structure, which can serve as a model for novelists aiming to cut extraneous content and focus on the core plot and character development. He draws on examples like "Mystic River," successfully translated from page to screen by focusing on the essence of the narrative.
Additionally, reversals and recognitions are discussed as essential elements of a complex plot. Douglas emphasizes that these should emerge from the story itself, not external forces, echoing Aristotle's disdain for deus ex machina resolutions. These reversals keep readers engaged with unexpected developments that are, nonetheless, rooted in the story's logic.
Finally, the discussion wraps up with a consideration of art as a reflection of its time. Matty and Douglas agree that older works should be viewed through the lens of their era, embracing the social mores of their time rather than altering them to fit modern standards.
For listeners who are novelists or storytellers, Douglas leaves them with an invitation to further explore Aristotle's principles by visiting a dedicated website and taking an assessment to see how their stories align with these timeless guidelines. He encourages writers to remain true to their unique voices while leveraging the structural wisdom handed down through centuries of storytelling craft.
This episode of The Indy Author Podcast offers valuable insights into how Aristotle's time-tested storytelling principles can enhance modern novel writing. Whether you’re revisiting the classics or writing your next big story, maintaining consistency, highlighting action over dialogue, and ensuring a logical flow make for compelling narratives that resonate with readers.
Episode 263 - Collaborate and Create with Michael La Ronn
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Michael La Ronn discusses COLLABORATE AND CREATE, including the intricacies of collaborative writing, and the importance of formal agreements when co-authoring a book. Michael highlights the necessity of having clear contracts to avoid misunderstandings and ensure smooth transitions in case one collaborator is unable to continue. They delve into practical writing tools like Google Docs and Microsoft Word, and discuss strategies for managing long-term collaborations, including effective marketing and promotional efforts. Emphasizing professionalism, clear communication, and adaptability, they share insights on leveraging each collaborator's strengths, assigning tasks based on expertise, and navigating the logistical challenges of joint promotional activities. The episode underscores the value of initial agreements, shared philosophies, and the application of organizational tools for successful collaboration.
Michael La Ronn has published many science fiction & fantasy books and self-help books for writers. He built a writing career publishing 10-12 books per year while raising a family, working a full-time job, and even attending law school classes in the evenings. Visit his fiction website at www.michaellaronn.com and his resources for writers at www.authorlevelup.com.
Episode Links
https://www.authorlevelup.com
https://www.youtube.com/authorlevelup
Companion Episodes:
Episode 261 - Navigating Collaborative Storytelling with Todd Fahnestock (on collaboration on fiction)
Summary
This week on The Indy Author Podcast, Matty Dalrymple talks with Michael La Ronn about the intricacies of co-authoring a book, drawing from their personal experiences collaborating on "From Page to Platform: How to Succeed as an Author Speaker." The discussion is a deep dive into the collaborative process, exploring everything from initial agreements to writing, editing, marketing, and distribution strategies.
The podcast underscores the importance of formal agreements when beginning a co-authoring project. Michael stresses that having a written contract keeps everyone honest and organized. The contract should cover critical aspects like royalty splits and decision-making authority–who has the final say if disagreements arise. Matty adds that these agreements prevent confusion over time, as co-authoring projects can stretch over years.
With the contract in place, the next step is coordinating the writing process. Both Matty and Michael found the process of selecting tools for collaboration surprisingly challenging. They experimented with Google Docs and Microsoft Word before deciding on a more effective method. They recommend creating independent drafts that funnel into one person for assembly, reducing repetitive content and improving efficiency. Matty uses the analogy of "digging the clay out of the sand" to describe this stage, emphasizing how essential it is for collaborators to continuously communicate and adjust.
The conversation shifts to discuss logistics, a critical element of maintaining a smooth workflow in co-authoring. Matty and Michael liken their method to airplane pilots passing control to one another. They emphasize using project management tools like Trello for task tracking and coordination, noting its usefulness in maintaining a centralized repository of project-related information.
In discussing marketing and distribution, Matty highlights their initial plan to use Draft2Digital for its royalty-splitting capabilities, but the ultimate decision to switch to distributing direct on Amazon because of discrepancies between the D2D and Amazon requirements regarding royalty levels and the additional management and promotional levers that managing Amazon books directly on KDP offer. They learned the importance of staying flexible and adapting their strategies as necessary.
The duo explores how each author's marketing strategies can diverge while still supporting the same project goals. Michael points out that both authors can bring their audiences to the new work, even if it means using different platforms or marketing strategies. They agree that it's vital to pull "in the same direction" to maximize the book's reach.
Matty and Michael also delve into the complexities of joint promotional appearances. While fun, these can be logistically challenging. They agree it's often more practical to appear individually, coordinating efforts to ensure consistent messaging.
The podcast concludes with reflections on their journey. Michael acknowledges that the chemistry between them made the collaboration smoother, while Matty appreciates the efficiency they have gained through consistent processes. They contemplate simplifying future projects by focusing on well-defined scopes, as they had with their current collaboration, limited to non-fiction topics.
In summary, Matty and Michael offer a comprehensive overview of their co-authoring experience, providing invaluable insights for anyone considering a similar partnership. They discuss tools, techniques, and philosophies that can help aspiring collaborators anticipate and overcome potential challenges, ensuring a project that not only succeeds but thrives.
Episode 261 - Navigating Collaborative Storytelling with Todd Fahnestock
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Todd Fahnestock discusses NAVIGATING COLLABORATIVE STORYTELLING, including the intricacies and benefits of collaborative writing, the flexibility required for successful collaborations, the dynamics of sharing creative control, and the emotional impact when projects don't meet expectations. He details the guidelines his collaborators in the ELDROS LEGACY series established to maintain world consistency, and the importance of a “just say yes” approach to foster creativity.
Todd Fahnestock is an award-winning, #1 bestselling author of fantasy for all ages and winner of the New York Public Library’s Books for the Teen Age Award. Threadweavers and The Whisper Prince Trilogy are two of his bestselling epic fantasy series. He is a founder of Eldros Legacy—a multi-author, shared-world mega-epic fantasy series—three-time winner of the Colorado Authors League Award for Writing Excellence, and two-time finalist for the Colorado Book Award for Tower of the Four: The Champions Academy (2021) and Khyven the Unkillable (2022). His passions are great stories and his quirky, fun-loving family. When he’s not writing, he travels the country meeting fans, gets inundated with befuddling TikTok videos by his son, plays board games with his wife, plots future stories with his daughter, and plays vigorously with Galahad the Weimaraner.
Episode Links
https://toddfahnestock.com/
https://www.facebook.com/todd.fahnestock
https://www.youtube.com/@toddfahnestock7108?app=desktop
Episode 224 - Secrets of Maximizing In-person Sales with Todd Fahnestock
Summary
This week on The Indy Author Podcast, Matty Dalrymple talks with Todd Fahnestock about various aspects of collaboration within the literary world. Todd, an award-winning, bestselling author of fantasy, shares insights from his experiences with both successful and challenging collaborations throughout his career.
Todd describes his early experiences of collaboration beginning in high school while role-playing with friends, which inspired his initial writing projects. He recounts an incomplete early project that was purely for fun and stopped due to their commitment-free approach. This transitions into discussing his first significant collaboration on "The Hearthstone Trilogy" with Giles Carwin, which was picked up by HarperCollins. Todd explains how the duo initially thrived on shared creativity, likening it to playing Dungeons and Dragons with a best friend. However, as they moved into subsequent drafts, conflicts emerged over creative decisions leading to stressful discussions. Despite their effort, the trilogy did not meet sales expectations and was dropped by the publisher, a pivotal moment Todd refers to as "falling to fly."
Matty then inquires about Todd’s reflections on whether the outcome would have been different if the work had been a commercial success. Todd speculates that success might not have alleviated the underlying tensions but rather exacerbated them. He philosophizes that success often magnifies existing problems rather than solving them and considers it possibly a blessing that their project did not lock them into a strained professional relationship.
The discussion moves onto Todd’s subsequent collaboration, "Eldros Legacy," a multi-author shared-world project. The collaboration includes authors working semi-independently on their respective continents but following a unified world’s rulebook. Todd emphasizes the benefits of collaboration, such as creating richer, more detailed worlds and contributing unique perspectives, while also acknowledging the challenges, such as coordinating visions and resolving disputes.
Matty explores the logistics behind managing such a large-scale collaboration. Todd elaborates on the multi-faceted roles of leading authors, who maintain creative autonomy over their continents while contributing to a synchronized world-building effort. Todd talks about the detailed world bible that outlines rules for magic and historical timelines, ensuring consistency across all authors' works. He describes the flexible structure allowing authors to either deeply integrate or minimally involve their stories with the overarching plot.
Addressing promotional strategies, Todd states that while they conducted joint activities initially, the group has become more individualized, although ready to collaborate on promotional efforts when needed again. Matty then discusses the flexibility inherent in handling the workload and creativity, which Todd agrees is crucial. They reflect on how rigid plans didn’t work, leading to a structure where authors are in charge of their continents, providing a balance between coordination and creative freedom.
The conversation also touches on Todd's interaction with cohort authors, who are not founding members but write within the Eldros world. He describes how this arrangement provides opportunities for broader storytelling while maintaining quality and coherence through oversight from continent leaders. Todd illustrates how new authors must submit writing samples and adhere to established world rules. He also discusses cover design coordination to ensure brand consistency while allowing artistic diversity.
Matty wraps up by mentioning her upcoming conversation with Michael La Ronn about co-authoring nonfiction, noting the significant differences in collaboration between fiction and nonfiction projects. She considers the idea of co-authoring a fiction piece with Michael to write about co-authoring fiction next.
Todd concludes by directing listeners to his website, ToddFahnestock.com, for more information and mentions his frequent appearances at conventions.
This podcast episode offers an in-depth look at literary collaboration, highlighting the balance of creative freedom, structural coordination, and the influence of success and failure. Todd’s insights provide valuable lessons for authors considering or engaged in collaborative projects.
Episode 253 - Navigating the Worlds of Fiction and Film with Rene Gutteridge
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Rene Gutteridge discusses NAVIGATING THE WORLDS OF FICTION AND FILM, including the nuances and intricacies involved in transitioning from writing novels to screenplays, the technical constraints in screenwriting, the necessity of collaboration in film, and the importance of adhering to a rigid structure. Rene also covers how understanding screenplay techniques can benefit novelists, particularly in terms of pacing and scene structure. She offers insights for novelists considering a venture into screenwriting, emphasizing the innate differences in storytelling approaches.
Rene Gutteridge has been writing professionally for over twenty years in fiction, non-fiction, comedy sketches, novelizations, and screenwriting. She is the multi-genre author of 24 novels plus several non-fiction titles. Her indie film SKID won deadCenter’s Best Oklahoma Feature in 2015, and her novel My Life as a Doormat was adapted into the Hallmark movie “Love’s Complicated.” She is co-writer on the feature film Family Camp, a Movieguide award winner and a Dove Award nominee for 2023. She is also a Screencraft finalist in true crime. Rene is co-director of WriterCon in Oklahoma City, senior contributor at Writing Momentum and is the head writer at Skit Guys Studios.
Episode Links
https://www.facebook.com/ReneGutteridgeAuthor
https://www.instagram.com/rene_gutteridge/
https://x.com/ReneGutteridge
Summary
This week on The Indy Author Podcast, Matty Dalrymple talks with Rene Gutteridge about the intricate world of screenwriting and how it compares to novel writing. Their conversation delves into the specifics of each medium, offering valuable insights for authors who might be contemplating a shift into screenwriting or simply looking to enhance their novel writing.
Transitioning from Novels to Screenplays
Rene starts by discussing her journey from screenwriting to novel writing and back. She began as a reader of screenplays during her high school years, influenced by her mother's dedication to encouraging her reading habits. Eventually, her early fascination with screenplays led her to write her own. Despite studying screenwriting in college, Rene shifted to novel writing due to the lack of a film scene in Oklahoma at the time.
Rene notes the significant differences between novels and screenplays, particularly the collaborative nature of screenwriting. While screenwriters plant the vision of the story, much of the creative process, including acting, direction, and set design, is handled by other team members. This necessity to share creative control can be a challenging adjustment for novelists who are used to having full authority over their work.
Reading Screenplays and the Importance of Detail
Rene explains how her interest in reading screenplays developed from childhood subscriptions to magazines that offered screenplay orders and later through her discovery of screenplays at the library. Moreover, she underscores the importance of understanding screenplays' structure and technical aspects to write compelling and coherent screenplays.
Matty brings up the concept of the reader or viewer filling in details, prompting a discussion on whether reading a screenplay requires the audience to imagine more than they would with a novel. Rene clarifies that screenplays must convey enough detail to guide the directors and actors while allowing them room to interpret the scene.
The Shared and Divergent Experiences in Mediums
The conversation shifts towards the experience of collaborative creativity in screenwriting, comparing it to the solo nature of novel writing. Rene appreciates those instances where directors and actors bring fresh, unexpected takes to scenes, acknowledging that while not every deviation aligns with her vision, the collaborative process often enriches the project.
Matty explores the dual nature of screenplays as both creative works and technical documents. Rene clarifies that screenplays contain specific technical directions, like sound and lighting cues, designed to assist various departments in a film's production. This technical precision is crucial for budgeting and execution.
Seeing Through the Characters' Eyes
The interplay between screenplays and deep point of view in novels is a recurring theme. Screenwriting demands brevity and clarity, often getting into a scene late and exiting early to maintain pace, while novels can explore deeper points of view and internal monologues.
Rene argues that novelists can learn the art of pacing from screenwriting, emphasizing the impact of knowing when to end a scene. This timing is pivotal not only for the audience but also to ensure that the narrative remains engaging. In screenwriting, every page counts, influencing the overall duration of the film, where one page typically equals one minute of screen time.
The Challenges of Adaptation
Rene discusses how authors should approach the adaptation of their novels into screenplays. It's often advised that experienced screenwriters handle adaptations, as the skills required are quite different. The novel's original narrative can serve as an inspiration rather than a verbatim transcription, capturing the essence of the story while adjusting it to suit the visual medium's needs.
The Impact of Fast-Paced Writing and Consideration of AI
Matty raises the subject of AI-generated content, pondering its potential influence on screenwriting and novel writing. Rene expresses her concern over AI's role, valuing the irreplaceable human element and creativity in storytelling. They discuss the evolving landscape, where AI might cater to readers looking for quantity, while quality-driven content remains the domain of human artists.
Learning from Screenwriting for Novelists
Even if novelists have no plans to write screenplays, they can still benefit from understanding screenwriting techniques. Learning when to enter and exit scenes, using concise language, and retaining a strong sense of character point of view can all enhance the pacing and quality of a novel.
Conclusion
Rene concludes by advising authors to balance their aspirations in screenwriting with their current projects. Screenwriting often involves selling spec scripts and working on assignments rather than solely relying on personal creative projects. Emphasizing the importance of perseverance and passion, Rene encourages authors to explore the exciting world of film while continuing to craft compelling narratives in their novels.
Through this detailed conversation, Matty Dalrymple and Rene Gutteridge provide a comprehensive guide for authors navigating the worlds of screenwriting and novel writing, highlighting the unique challenges and opportunities each medium presents.
Episode 250 - From Firearms to Fiction with Chris Grall
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Chris Grall discusses FROM FIREARMS TO FICTION, including his book TRIGGER GUARD: A WRITER'S GUIDE TO FIREARMS. Chris shares the challenges he faced in creating consistent and accurate illustrations for his book, with some valuable do’s and don’t’s for authors with books that include illustrations; the attitude he brought to receiving feedback from his target audiences; and the goal of his book: to enable writers to write gripping and accurate firearms scenes.
Chris Grall is a retired US Special Forces team sergeant with 26 years of service. In 2007, he served as a technical advisor for Scott Sigler's book CONTAGIOUS, and since then, he’s shared his knowledge of firearms with authors via his consulting business, TactiQuill, and at conferences.
Episode Links
https://trigger-guard.com/
https://chrisgrall.com/
https://www.facebook.com/chris.grall.9
https://x.com/dtn8or
Summary
This week on The Indy Author Podcast, Matty Dalrymple talks with Chris Grall about various facets of writing about firearms in fiction and the challenges he encountered while creating his book, "Trigger Guard." Chris shares his journey, from illustration and formatting struggles to gathering meaningful feedback for his work.
Matty Dalrymple, the host, sets the stage for an insightful conversation by detailing how she first met Chris, who has a unique background as a retired U.S. Special Forces Team Sergeant and a consultant on firearms for authors. Chris's journey culminated in the creation of "Trigger Guard," a comprehensive guide for writers on the usage and detailed aspects of firearms.
Illustration Challenges
Chris highlights how he tackled the illustrations for "Trigger Guard." He created the illustrations himself using PowerPoint, a process that turned out to be labor-intensive and time-consuming.
He explained, "It was painful. It would take me at least two or three hours just to do a single firearm, and I think there are a hundred and something drawings in there. It was horrible."
When Matty inquired whether Chris had considered using photographs instead, Chris clarified that maintaining consistency across all illustrations was crucial. He noted that stock images could have been expensive and inconsistent, thus justifying the choice to create his own graphics.
Choosing the Right Approach
Chris mentioned that with hindsight, he might have approached the process differently. Instead of illustrating sporadically, he would have initially examined all the firearms he planned to include to avoid unnecessary work.
"Through the editing process, that gun fell out of the book as a specific firearm I was going to talk about," Chris said, emphasizing the importance of forethought in the creative process.
Deadlines as Motivators
Chris attributed a significant part of his productivity to setting personal deadlines. His goal was to have "Trigger Guard" ready for purchase by ThrillerFest, a conference that he believed would be the ideal exhibition platform. He emphasized how having a deadline can enhance efficiency:
"There are points where you are a slave to the process and you have no control over how much time it takes for some things to happen."
DIY Publishing and Marketing Choices
The decision to indie publish "Trigger Guard" was influenced by Chris’s desire to get the book to the market quickly, especially considering its niche nature. Going the traditional publishing route could have delayed the book’s availability significantly, a luxury he couldn’t afford given the book’s specific audience.
“Trigger Guard is a very niche book. It’s not gonna be a New York Times bestseller... the faster I could get it out, the faster people could get access to it, use it, and hopefully not make mistakes.”
Content Creation and Layout
Chris provided a candid reflection on the initial decision to draft the entire book using PowerPoint, which made the editing process cumbersome. Illustrations and text elements would displace upon converting documents, causing significant headaches.
"The original sin of this book was to do the entire first draft in PowerPoint. It was a horror show."
Feedback and Iteration
Gathering feedback was another critical component of Chris's process. He sought insights from three distinct groups: authors, firearms experts, and general readers. This multifaceted feedback enabled him to fine-tune the book to serve various levels of firearms knowledge.
Balancing Detail and Readability
Matty and Chris also discussed the importance of balancing technical details with readability in fiction. Chris stressed that while writers need to possess detailed knowledge, they should be cautious about overwhelming readers with excessive technicalities.
"I like generic actions with specific firearms. You’re going to load a gun, you’re going to fire a gun, you’re going to aim the gun... That’s good enough for most scenes."
He recounted practical examples and mistakes, such as the common but incorrect portrayal of empty guns clicking, underscoring the importance of accuracy.
Inspirations for Fictional Gunfights
Chris shared case studies from real-life scenarios, such as the assassination attempt on Harry Truman, to illustrate the unpredictable and often chaotic nature of gunfights. These examples serve as valuable resources for authors aiming to depict realistic firearms scenes.
Conclusion
In summarizing the wealth of experience, Chris offers valuable advice for both writers and readers. Chris's approach to creating "Trigger Guard" and his candid reflections on the process provide strong takeaways for any author dealing with technical subjects in their writing.
"Trigger Guard is meant for anyone in the full array of firearms experience. You can use it as a resource or read it cover to cover."
Final Thoughts
Chris's journey exemplifies the intricate balance between technical accuracy and creative storytelling. His insights into the challenges of illustrative consistency, the importance of deadlines, and the necessity for diverse feedback make this podcast episode a must-listen for any author dealing with specialized topics.
For more, you can find Chris Grall and his work at ChrisGrall.com, Trigger-Guard.com, and his consulting venture Tactiquill.com.
Episode 249 - How to Keep Non-Fiction Fresh with Anna Featherstone
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I talk with Anna Featherstone about HOW TO KEEP NON-FICTION FRESH, including maintaining the human touch in an age of AI, the importance of fresh perspectives, effective book proposals, and integrating multiple viewpoints. Anna also emphasizes the need for authenticity, the strategic exclusion of outdated or overly technical information, and innovative formats that can enhance the reader's experience.
Anna Featherstone mentors and empowers writers who value practical, warm, wise, and creative advice during the various stages of writing, publishing and marketing their words. She is the author of five non-fiction books, a judge of the Australian Business Book Awards, and the non-fiction book advisor to The Alliance of Independent Authors (ALLi). Anna is also the founder of Bold Authors, a collaborative online hub where publishing insiders share their insights about writing, publishing, and book marketing. When she’s not being bookish, Anna is a seedsaver, and into bees, beings, and the big issues of our time.
Episode Links
https://annafeatherstone.com/
https://www.instagram.com/annafeatherstonewriter/
https://www.linkedin.com/in/anna-featherstone-writer/
https://www.threads.net/@annafeatherstonewriter
https://www.facebook.com/AnnaFeatherstoneWriter/
https://aus.social/@AnnaFeatherstone
Summary
This week on The Indy Author Podcast, Matty Dalrymple talks with Anna Featherstone about her insights on how to keep nonfiction writing fresh and engaging. The discussion covers Anna's motivations for writing nonfiction, different strategies to maintain freshness, and suggestions for nonfiction authors to enhance their writing process.
Anna's Journey into Nonfiction
Anna Featherstone shares that her passion for writing nonfiction began with a deep love for exploring topics through writing. She emphasizes that the clarity and understanding she gains from writing help her make sense of the world. Anna appreciates nonfiction for its ability to develop empathy and provide insights into different perspectives.
The Importance of Freshness in Nonfiction
Anna believes that keeping nonfiction fresh is crucial for both writers and readers. A stale narrative can drive readers away and make the writing process tedious for the author. To combat this, Anna suggests putting a project aside if it starts feeling dull. She asserts that the energy and passion for a topic should be present from the beginning of the writing process, including during the creation of a book proposal.
Book Proposals as a Tool
Anna discusses the importance of writing a book proposal, even if it’s just for oneself. A book proposal helps in planning and gauging one’s commitment to a project. According to Anna, it includes the book's basic idea, market placement, target audience, marketing ideas, and potential experts for interviews. This process helps filter out projects that might not be worth pursuing and ensures that the writer’s enthusiasm remains high throughout the writing process.
Bringing Fresh Perspectives
One of the most effective ways to keep nonfiction fresh is by offering a unique perspective. Anna encourages authors to consider alternative angles that haven't been overexplored. For example, a book on knitting written by a man or a parenting guide co-authored by a teenager would bring unusually fresh viewpoints. Anna also emphasizes the value of choosing unique and lesser-known experts for interviews to avoid overused quotes and ideas.
Handling AI in Nonfiction Writing
The conversation touches on the role of AI in nonfiction. Anna shares her reluctance to use AI extensively in her projects, expressing concerns about losing the uniqueness of her fresh ideas to the machine. Instead, she prefers to keep her work original and authentic by relying mainly on tools like ProWritingAid for final cleanups rather than content generation.
Engaging with Sensory Details
Anna recommends incorporating sensory details to make writing more engaging. Describing experiences in a way that involves sight, sound, touch, taste, and smell can make a story come alive for readers. This technique can be applied beyond memoirs to other nonfiction topics, enhancing the reader’s connection with the content.
Collaborations and Multiple Viewpoints
Collaborating with others can add depth and freshness to a book. Anna gives an example of a memoir enriched by including perspectives from different family members. This multi-faceted approach can provide a more comprehensive and engaging narrative. Moreover, including interviews and case studies from a diverse set of people worldwide can expand the book’s appeal and marketing potential.
Practical Strategies for Marketing Nonfiction
Anna offers practical advice on marketing nonfiction work. She highlights the importance of bullet points and concise, targeted pitches when reaching out to bloggers, podcasters, and reviewers. She also suggests conducting interviews to gather content and marketing opportunities, recommending that authors leverage international interviews to gain fresh perspectives.
Evergreen Content vs. Timely Trends
Matty and Anna discuss the balance between creating evergreen content and capitalizing on current trends. While evergreen content remains relevant for a longer period, timely topics, such as AI, can attract immediate attention but may quickly become outdated. Authors need to be clear about their strategy and the lifespan they expect for their work.
Making Content Personal and Unique
To stand out, nonfiction should reflect the author’s unique voice and experiences. Anna jokes about using personal anecdotes, humor, and unique metaphorical structures to make the content more relatable and engaging. Matty shares how she used a nautical metaphor throughout her book to provide a fresh twist on the topic of podcasting.
Conclusion
Anna Featherstone’s advice centers on the principle that fresh, engaging nonfiction results from passion, unique perspectives, and smart planning. Whether through multi-sensory details, unique angles, or strategic collaborations, authors can keep their non-fiction vibrant and appealing to readers. Anna encourages writers to allow their individuality to shine through their content, ensuring their book stands out in a crowded market.
Episode 248 - Constructing a Multi-Layered Villain with Greta Boris
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Greta Boris discusses CONSTRUCTING A MULTI-LAYERED VILLAIN, including how analyzing villains in our previous works can help us understand what does and doesn’t work with readers and how characters' personalities, based on tools like Enneagram, influence their effectiveness as villains. We also explore examples of well-crafted villains from TV shows like Breaking Bad and movies like The Silence of the Lambs. Greta shares insights from her personal writing process and touches on the challenges and nuances of writing morally complex villains.
Greta Boris is the USA Today Bestselling author of The Mortician Murders, a ghosty mystery series, and the soon to be released Almost True Crime thriller series. She's also co-creator of The Author Wheel, producers of books, courses, and a podcast dedicated to helping writers overcome their roadblocks.
Episode Links
https://www.gretaboris.com
https://www.facebook.com/greta.boris/
https://podcast.authorwheel.com
Summary
This week on The Indy Author Podcast, I talk with Greta Boris about the multifaceted nature of villains in storytelling. Our conversation explores various themes, from the allure of playful antagonists to the competition between heroes and villains, offering valuable insights for authors and storytellers.
The Multifaceted Villain
In our discussion, Greta emphasizes that a great villain often possesses layers beyond mere malice. She points out that memorable antagonists, like Moriarty from the Sherlock Holmes series, captivate audiences not just through their deeds but through their complex personalities.
Playfulness and Competition
We discuss the playful nature of villains, using Moriarty as an example. This playful aspect makes the character's interactions with Sherlock Holmes more compelling. This is a broader trait found in other notable villains such as Hannibal Lecter, who engages in an intellectual game with his enemies. This playfulness, combined with a sense of competition, adds layers to their personalities, making them more engaging for the audience.
Beyond the Archetype
Our conversation also delves into the importance of moving beyond archetypical representations of villains. We discuss how adding unique traits and motivations can significantly enhance a villain's depth. For instance, a villain who sees their actions as a game can create a dynamic interplay with the hero, pushing the narrative in unexpected directions.
The Role of Perspective
We touch on how a villain's perspective can redefine the story. By exploring the villain’s mindset and motivations, writers can create more rounded characters whose actions, although villainous, are understandable within their own logic. This approach not only enriches the story but also challenges the audience to see the world from a different point of view.
Key Takeaways
1. Complex Characters: Villains with multifaceted personalities are often more engaging and memorable.
2. Playful Antagonists: Incorporating a sense of playfulness and competition can add depth to villain-hero dynamics.
3. Unique Motivations: Moving beyond archetypes and exploring unique motivations can enhance character development.
4. Perspective Matters: Understanding a villain’s perspective can add richness to the story and offer new angles for the narrative.
Episode 246 - The Secrets of World-Building: It’s the Small Stuff with Timons Esaias
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Timons Esaias discusses THE SECRETS OF WORLD-BUILDING: IT’S THE SMALL STUFF, including his insights into effective world-building for fiction, emphasizing the importance of small, non-generic details that enhance character development and scene-setting. He touches on the difference between immersive storytelling and simpler narratives and offers practical tips on how to gather and use unique details from ephemera, old books, and postcards to enrich a narrative. He offers guidance on balancing research with storytelling ... and on knowing when to stop.
Timons Esaias is a satirist, writer, and poet living in Pittsburgh. His works, ranging from literary to genre, have been published in twenty-two languages. He has been a finalist for the British Science Fiction Award, and he won the Winter Anthology Contest, the SFPA Poetry Contest, and the Asimov's Readers Award (twice). He is a recent Pushcart nominee, and Intrepid Award winner for the story "To Do." His poetry collection is “Why Elephants No Longer Communicate in Greek.” He collects chess sets.
Episode Links
https://twitter.com/EsaiasTimons
https://www.facebook.com/timons.esaias/
https://www.goodreads.com/author/show/867037.Timons_Esaias
Summary
The interview opened with an introduction to Timons Esaias, an esteemed satirist, writer, and poet. He's known for his diverse literary works published in 22 languages and his accolades, including being a finalist for the British Science Fiction Award and winning multiple writing contests. The conversation aimed to delve deep into the nuances of world-building and character development in fiction writing.
The Importance of Small Details
Timons began by emphasizing the importance of integrating small, meaningful details into both world-building and character development. He noted that focusing on particulars like adornments, everyday tools, and small personal items adds depth and authenticity to the narrative.
Quote: "One of the things I find missing in fiction is anybody wearing anything and any story behind it."
By concentrating on these finer elements, writers can convey much more about their characters and settings without overwhelming the reader with exhaustive descriptions.
Leveraging Playsearch for World-Building
Timons introduced the concept of "playsearch", a playful and exploratory approach to research. Instead of traditional research methods, playsearch involves flipping through old catalogues, postcards, and ephemera to draw inspiration and authentic details for fictional worlds.
Example: "For a science fiction setting, I can look at 1886 and go, okay, that's already changed. How will it change again by the time it's in my story?"
This method helps writers to add realism and depth to their settings by drawing on historical and cultural references.
Emphasizing Character Reactions
Timons argued for the importance of focusing on character reactions rather than exhaustive physical descriptions. Readers will naturally form their own mental images of characters, making it more impactful to describe how characters make others feel or react.
Quote: "We judge people in an instant when we meet them. And it's utterly unfair, but we do it."
This approach ensures that descriptions serve a narrative purpose and deepen the reader's engagement with the characters.
Using Cultural Exceptions to Establish Norms
Illustrating cultural norms through exceptions is another powerful tool Timons recommends. By showing what happens when something goes wrong or deviates from the norm, writers can effectively establish the rules of their fictional world.
Example: "You get somebody upset by the fact that it's not working, now we know what the rules are."
Strategic Research Approaches
While emphasizing the importance of research, Timons advised writers to write their initial drafts first and then conduct targeted research to fill in specific gaps. This ensures that time is spent effectively on indispensable details that contribute to the story.
Quote: "Write the story first, then research the things you need."
He also pointed out that different audiences require different levels of detail. Writers should balance the depth of their world-building based on whether their readers prefer immersive worlds or simpler, more focused storytelling.
The Role of Architecture and Maps
Timons discussed the value of books on architecture and maps as essential resources for sparking creativity and ensuring consistency in world-building. These resources offer insights into different time periods and cultural practices, helping writers create believable settings.
Example: "I have this history of London in maps... it's been useful, especially with students who are setting things in London."
Understanding the layout of streets and the architectural styles of different periods enhances the authenticity and inspires new ideas for settings.
Practical Insight: Matty mentioned how historical research helped him avoid mistakes, like discovering that a modern through street was not a through street in the past due to a fire. Such details honor the setting and improve the reader's experience.
Distinctive Character Development
Timons highlighted the importance of describing unique behaviors or possessions of characters instead of falling back on generic traits. This makes characters more memorable and authentic.
Quote: "Find a thing, or a behavior, that will reveal it."
By focusing on specific, revealing details, writers can avoid repetitive descriptions and instead use these to deepen character development.
Knowing When to Stop Researching
Recognizing when to stop researching and start writing can be challenging. Timons offered practical advice: if you feel drained by a story, it's likely you’ve gathered sufficient information.
Quote: "Psychologically, if you're shelving a story because you are just tired of it, it's probably tired of you."
This helps writers avoid endless cycles of research that don't contribute meaningfully to the narrative.
Effective Writing Techniques
Timons shared several practical writing techniques:
1. Start in the Middle: Captivate readers quickly by dropping them into the middle of the action and revealing the world's details gradually.
Example: "With immersive settings, start in the middle. Have a lot of stuff going by that’s interesting but you don’t explain at first."
2. Infuse Meaning: Ensure every descriptive element in the story adds plot complexity or character depth.
Quote: "Only if you're adding plot complexity in an interesting way or meaning should a thing be in there."
3. Secret Symbolism: Using secret meanings or symbolic elements, which might not be immediately apparent to readers, can give depth to the narrative.
Example: Timons mentioned using a real map and fictionalizing its details to create an underlying structure of meaning.
Resource Recommendations
Timons recommended exploring museums and antique shops, as they often contain bins of old postcards or books that provide historical context and inspiration.
Quote: "Little bins full of old postcards... frequently, it’s not the main thing they’re portraying but what is parked next to it or what the gal in the front is wearing."
In addition, he suggested looking through travel guides and ephemera for insights into daily life and cultural practices that add realism to writing.
Conclusion
Timons’ approach to incorporating small, meaningful details, leveraging real-world inspiration, and using practical research techniques can help any writer elevate their storytelling. By focusing on these aspects, writers can create rich, immersive narratives that resonate with readers, making fictional worlds feel as real as the one we live in.