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    • 168 - How to Write from Trauma
    • 167 - Good Habits and Accountability Groups
    • 166 - Plotting with an Unreliable Narrator
    • 165 - Strengthening Your Fiction with a Premise
    • 164 - What Writers Can Learn from Short Fiction
    • 163 - Year End: The Writing Craft And The Publishing Voyage
    • 162 - Book Marketing Lessons from Beyond the Book World
    • 161 - Choosing Your Publishing Path
    • 160 - Mistakes Writers Make about Police Roles
    • 159 - Backstory: Mountaintop or Valley
    • 158 - What Writers Can Learn from Remote Workers
    • 157 - Literary Citizenship
    • 156 - Character Development Through the Pain and Promise of Life
    • 155 - The Benefits (and Costs) of Membership
    • 154 - From Screenplay to Novel and Back
    • 153 - The Importance of a Professional Photo and Video Presence
    • 152 - The Three Stages of Story
    • 151 - Setting Your Creative Horizons
    • 150 - Hands-off Merchandising for Authors
    • 149 - Using Vulnerability to Feed your Creativity
    • 148 - Making the Most of In-person Events
    • 147 - Writing for Audio
    • 146 - Managing Writing with a Full-time Career
    • 145 - Speech to Text and Back Again
    • 144 - Reaching the Right Readers through Email
    • 143 - Getting into the Mind of Your Audience
    • 142 - A New Era for Novellas
    • 141 - The Value of Collaboration
    • 140 - Troping Your Way to a Stronger Story
    • 139 - Mistakes Writers Make about Forensic Psychiatry
    • 138 - ROI for Authors
    • 137 - Using Podcasts to Support Your Book Launch
    • 136 - Looking Forward in Indy Publishing
    • 135 - The Importance of Specificity
    • 134 - How Horror is the Genre of Hope
    • 133 - Creating an AI-narrated Audiobook
    • 132 - From Big Idea to Book
    • 131 - The Color Wheel of Characterization
    • 130 - Outsourcing Your Content Creation
    • 129 - Moving for Creativity
    • 128 - Lessons from Filmmaking
    • 127 - Mistakes Writers Make about PIs
    • 126 - Estate Planning for Authors
    • 125 - The Seven Most Common Mistakes of Non-Fiction Authors
    • 124 - The Rise of Subscription Models
    • 123 - Building Engaging Worlds
    • 122 - Using Data to Guide Your Craft
    • 121 - Story Structure and Character Motivation
    • 120 - Draft2Digital Updates: Smashwords and Print
    • 119 - Metadata Is Your Brand
    • 118 - The Martial Art of Writing
    • 117 - Tracking Sales Data and How ScribeCount Can Help
    • 116 - Creating Community, Content, and Creative Energy
    • 115 - Exploring Kindle Vella
    • 114 - Making Smart Decisions about Your Distribution Strategy
    • 113 - What Authors Can Learn from Theater
    • 112 - Being the Captain of Your Author Voyage
    • 111 - Using Engines, Anchors, and Hazards to Define Character Voice
    • 110 - Making Meaningful Connections through Powerful Language
    • 109 - Wide Retailers and Aggregators
    • 108 - Writing Non-fiction from the Inside
    • 107 - Publishing Process #7: Selective Rights Licensing
    • 106 - Publishing Process #6: Promotion
    • 105 - Publishing Process #5: Marketing
    • 104 - Publishing Process #4: Distribution
    • 103 - Publishing Process #3: Production
    • 102 - Publishing Process #2: Design
    • 101 - Publishing Process #1: Editorial
    • 100 - Becoming a Relaxed Author
    • 099 - Connecting with Fans through Merchandising
    • 098 - Redefining Indy Success through Short Fiction
    • 097 - Taking the Long View
    • 096 - Emerging Tech for the Writing Craft
    • 095 - Finding and Being a Ghostwriter
    • 094 - Debunking Writing Myths
    • 093 - Valuing the Creative Process
    • 092 - Finding a Crew for Your Creative Voyage
    • 091 - Creating Stellar Side Characters
    • 090 - Bringing a Creative Endeavor to an End
    • 089 - The Both-ness of Compelling Characters
    • 088 - How to Receive and Give Critique
    • 087 - Looking Back and Forward at Indy Publishing
    • 086 - Overhauling Keywords
    • 085 - Optimizing Your Keywords
    • 084 - Using Content Legally
    • 083 - Six Rs of Maximizing the Value of Your Content
    • 082 - Perspectives on Writer's Block
    • 081 - Human-Centered Marketing
    • 080 - The Force of a Brand
    • 079 - Making the Most of Your Short Fiction
    • 078 - Living Your Best Creative Life
    • 077 - Behind the Scenes of My Book Launch
    • 076 - BookFunnel
    • 075 - Key Book Publishing Paths
    • 074 - Perspectives on Personal Branding
    • 073 - Author Websites
    • 072 - Mentoring and Collaborating with Interns
    • 071 - Provider Side of Author Services
    • 070 - Copyright for Authors
    • 069 - Writing Memoir
    • 068 - Handling Difficult Topics in YA Fiction
    • 067 - Mistakes Writers Make about the FBI
    • 066 - From Indy to Traditional
    • 065 - X-raying Your Plot
    • 064 - Children's Books
    • 063 - Wide for the Win
    • 062 - Point of View
    • 061 - Google Play
    • 060 - Mastering Action Sequences
    • 059 - Newsletter Swaps and StoryOrigin
    • 058 - Author Newsletters
    • 057 - The Pros and Cons of Pre-orders
    • 056 - Crowdfunding for Authors
    • 055 - Costs of Self-publishing a Book
    • 054 - Futurist Trends We Can Prepare for Now
    • 053 - Learn from TV and Movies
    • 052 - Building a Resilient Indy Business
    • 051 - Podcasting as Content Marketing
    • 050 - First Responders
    • 049 - Ruminations on Book Launches
    • 048 - Protagonist and Antagonist Voices
    • 047 - Backstory and Flashbacks
    • 046 - Writing Coroners
    • 045 - Exercise
    • 044 - Using Aggregators versus Direct
    • 043 - Killing Suspense
    • 042 - The Importance of Metadata
    • 041 - Writing Convincing Villains
    • 040 - Storytelling Lessons from Investigative Reporting
    • 039 Building a Writer Community
    • 038 - Graphic Novels
    • 037 - How Cozy is Cozy?
    • 036 - Frugal Tips for Writers
    • 035 - Police Procedures
    • 034 - Connecting through Video
    • 033 - Barriers to Creativity
    • 032 - Hybrid Publishing
    • 031 - ebook Pricing
    • 030 - Common Writer Wisdom: Is it Right for You?
    • 029 - Fostering Creativity through Digital Minimalism
    • 028 - Writing the Killer Query
    • 027 - Why to Stop Blogging
    • 026 - Weaving Your Day Job into Your Books
    • 025 - Mastering Book Descriptions
    • 024 - Three Hard Truths
    • 023 - Reaching New Readers through Translations
    • 022 - SEO for Authors
    • 021 - Building Communities in Podcasts and In Person
    • 020 - Working with Libraries & Bookstores
    • 019 - Judging a Book by Its Cover
    • 018 - The Importance of Masterworks
    • 017 - Story a Day
    • 016 - Drawing Back the Publishing Curtain
    • 015 - Five Things I Wish I Knew Before I Was Published
    • 014 - Collaborating on "Taking the Short Tack"
    • 013 - Writing in Time
    • 012 - Top Firearms Mistakes Writers Make ...
    • 011 - Making the Move to Full-Time Writer
    • 010 - Update from The Indy Author
    • 009 - Craft and Business of Short Fiction
    • 008 - Screenwriting
    • 007 - Faster Fiction
    • 006 - Importance of Storytelling
    • 005 - Image-intensive Books
    • 004 - Using Media Outlets
    • 003 - Small Press Publishing
    • 002 - Creativity Tips
    • 001 - Introducing The Indy Author
    • For Guests of The Indy Author Podcast
    • Podcast Guest and Topic Proposals
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  • Creating a Story Frame
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  • Affiliates
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    • Getting Past the Fear of (First Draft) Commitment
    • Scalability
    • Professionalism
    • From Dead in the Water to Favorable Winds
  • The Voyage
    • Reading Your Work Aloud
    • Preparing to Request an Author Blurb
    • Navigating Indy
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Episode 162 - Book Marketing Lessons from Beyond the Book World with Gary Zenker

November 29, 2022
I talk with Gary Zenker about BOOK MARKETING LESSONS FROM BEYOND THE BOOK WORLD, including what authors can learn from comic books and tattoo artists, how to drive interest for the next offering, the importance of not taking your reader out of the story, not wasting your best vehicle (your own books), the flexibility indy authors have in experimenting with promotional approaches, and how sometimes it's not about selling.
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By day, Gary Zenker is a marketing professional, banging out marketing plans, business plans, and copy for B2B and B2C clients. By night, he takes the lessons of human behavior and crafts them into flash fiction stories. His work has appeared in over a dozen print anthologies and on-line sites. His non-fiction columns on writing and various marketing topics have appeared in a variety of publications. He founded and continues to run the Main Line Writers Group and the Wilmington/Chadds Ford Writers Group to help local authors better their craft and reach their publishing goals. His party game WritersBloxx, helps others bring their stories to new audiences.
"I always wring my hands when I go, oh, and what did you put in the back of the book? Did you put ads for your other books? Did you put anything that links them back to you in some way? And most people say no. I want to pull out what's left of my hair. You've got the best vehicle you could ever have. Why aren't you using that?" —Gary Zenker
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Links

Gary's Links:
WEBSITES:
www.GaryZenkerStoryteller.com
www.NoirInABar.com
www.ZenkerMarketing.com
www.MainLineWritersGroup.com
SOCIAL MEDIA:
https://www.facebook.com/gary.zenker
https://www.facebook.com/gary.zenker]

Matty's Links:
Affiliate links
Events

I hope you enjoyed my conversation with Gary! At the end of our conversation, I summarized the message as being that any way that you can expand the interaction you have and deepen the interaction you have with the people that you want to reach is our goal as authors. Which of Gary’s great ideas about ways you can do that most struck your fancy, and how might you act on that idea? I’d love to hear your thoughts!
Please post your comments on YouTube--and I'd love it if you would subscribe while you're there!

From the Intro: Book Cover Redesign

In the introduction to this episode, I shared some information shared with me by John Gaspard about his experience with a book cover redesign ... more detail provided here! 
I was just listening to your latest episode and thought you might like to hear about my own adventures in re-doing covers for a cozy series.

I started the series — The Como Lake Players mystery series — using a female pen name, just to see if that made any difference in sales (the books also have a female lead, so it sort of made sense). I’ve attached the First Version.

I didn’t get a lot of traction with the first covers (which I had done via 99 Designs), so after a couple years, I handed them over to my usual cover designer (who does all the Eli Marks books and my filmmaking books) and he came up with a fun retro look. This is the Second Version (attached), still with the pen name.

Earlier this year, as I was entering a big cozy promotion, I took a hard look at all the other books in the promotion and came to the realization that my Como Lake Players series covers simply didn’t seem to fit. I needed something brighter and flashier.

So I went back to my cover designer and he produced the Final Version. (Also attached)

I also dropped the pen name. I did it for this reason: I had built up such traction with the Eli Marks fan base, that it seemed silly to not build on that with this second series. My readers seem to agree, as sales for the Como Lake Players series have gone up. Was it the new covers or the switching out of the pen name? I think it was a little of both.

Anyway, I’m glad I did it and the new covers have pretty much paid for themselves in the first three months.
Version 1
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Version 2
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Version 3
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NOTE: After several years of trying to cover the costs of producing the podcast with earnings from patronage and sponsorships, I finally had to acknowledge that, for now at least, The Indy Author Podcast is more a labor of love than an income stream. ​As a result, I needed to find ways to reduce my expenses, and the expense I finally decided to eliminate was the editing of the transcript. ​

However, it's valuable for me to know that you were looking for it! If you miss the transcript, please click here to drop me a note!

If you'd like to become a patron of The Indy Author, please click here.

When AI transcription improves to the point that it doesn't require the time and expense of a human edit, or once my earnings from the podcast enable me to cover the costs of a human editing, I will resume that offering!
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© 2013-2023 William Kingsfield Publishers
  • Home
  • About & Contact
  • Podcast
    • 171 - Outside-the-Box Content
    • 170 - Creating a Winning Workbook
    • 169 - The Do's and Don'ts of Working with Book Bloggers
    • 168 - How to Write from Trauma
    • 167 - Good Habits and Accountability Groups
    • 166 - Plotting with an Unreliable Narrator
    • 165 - Strengthening Your Fiction with a Premise
    • 164 - What Writers Can Learn from Short Fiction
    • 163 - Year End: The Writing Craft And The Publishing Voyage
    • 162 - Book Marketing Lessons from Beyond the Book World
    • 161 - Choosing Your Publishing Path
    • 160 - Mistakes Writers Make about Police Roles
    • 159 - Backstory: Mountaintop or Valley
    • 158 - What Writers Can Learn from Remote Workers
    • 157 - Literary Citizenship
    • 156 - Character Development Through the Pain and Promise of Life
    • 155 - The Benefits (and Costs) of Membership
    • 154 - From Screenplay to Novel and Back
    • 153 - The Importance of a Professional Photo and Video Presence
    • 152 - The Three Stages of Story
    • 151 - Setting Your Creative Horizons
    • 150 - Hands-off Merchandising for Authors
    • 149 - Using Vulnerability to Feed your Creativity
    • 148 - Making the Most of In-person Events
    • 147 - Writing for Audio
    • 146 - Managing Writing with a Full-time Career
    • 145 - Speech to Text and Back Again
    • 144 - Reaching the Right Readers through Email
    • 143 - Getting into the Mind of Your Audience
    • 142 - A New Era for Novellas
    • 141 - The Value of Collaboration
    • 140 - Troping Your Way to a Stronger Story
    • 139 - Mistakes Writers Make about Forensic Psychiatry
    • 138 - ROI for Authors
    • 137 - Using Podcasts to Support Your Book Launch
    • 136 - Looking Forward in Indy Publishing
    • 135 - The Importance of Specificity
    • 134 - How Horror is the Genre of Hope
    • 133 - Creating an AI-narrated Audiobook
    • 132 - From Big Idea to Book
    • 131 - The Color Wheel of Characterization
    • 130 - Outsourcing Your Content Creation
    • 129 - Moving for Creativity
    • 128 - Lessons from Filmmaking
    • 127 - Mistakes Writers Make about PIs
    • 126 - Estate Planning for Authors
    • 125 - The Seven Most Common Mistakes of Non-Fiction Authors
    • 124 - The Rise of Subscription Models
    • 123 - Building Engaging Worlds
    • 122 - Using Data to Guide Your Craft
    • 121 - Story Structure and Character Motivation
    • 120 - Draft2Digital Updates: Smashwords and Print
    • 119 - Metadata Is Your Brand
    • 118 - The Martial Art of Writing
    • 117 - Tracking Sales Data and How ScribeCount Can Help
    • 116 - Creating Community, Content, and Creative Energy
    • 115 - Exploring Kindle Vella
    • 114 - Making Smart Decisions about Your Distribution Strategy
    • 113 - What Authors Can Learn from Theater
    • 112 - Being the Captain of Your Author Voyage
    • 111 - Using Engines, Anchors, and Hazards to Define Character Voice
    • 110 - Making Meaningful Connections through Powerful Language
    • 109 - Wide Retailers and Aggregators
    • 108 - Writing Non-fiction from the Inside
    • 107 - Publishing Process #7: Selective Rights Licensing
    • 106 - Publishing Process #6: Promotion
    • 105 - Publishing Process #5: Marketing
    • 104 - Publishing Process #4: Distribution
    • 103 - Publishing Process #3: Production
    • 102 - Publishing Process #2: Design
    • 101 - Publishing Process #1: Editorial
    • 100 - Becoming a Relaxed Author
    • 099 - Connecting with Fans through Merchandising
    • 098 - Redefining Indy Success through Short Fiction
    • 097 - Taking the Long View
    • 096 - Emerging Tech for the Writing Craft
    • 095 - Finding and Being a Ghostwriter
    • 094 - Debunking Writing Myths
    • 093 - Valuing the Creative Process
    • 092 - Finding a Crew for Your Creative Voyage
    • 091 - Creating Stellar Side Characters
    • 090 - Bringing a Creative Endeavor to an End
    • 089 - The Both-ness of Compelling Characters
    • 088 - How to Receive and Give Critique
    • 087 - Looking Back and Forward at Indy Publishing
    • 086 - Overhauling Keywords
    • 085 - Optimizing Your Keywords
    • 084 - Using Content Legally
    • 083 - Six Rs of Maximizing the Value of Your Content
    • 082 - Perspectives on Writer's Block
    • 081 - Human-Centered Marketing
    • 080 - The Force of a Brand
    • 079 - Making the Most of Your Short Fiction
    • 078 - Living Your Best Creative Life
    • 077 - Behind the Scenes of My Book Launch
    • 076 - BookFunnel
    • 075 - Key Book Publishing Paths
    • 074 - Perspectives on Personal Branding
    • 073 - Author Websites
    • 072 - Mentoring and Collaborating with Interns
    • 071 - Provider Side of Author Services
    • 070 - Copyright for Authors
    • 069 - Writing Memoir
    • 068 - Handling Difficult Topics in YA Fiction
    • 067 - Mistakes Writers Make about the FBI
    • 066 - From Indy to Traditional
    • 065 - X-raying Your Plot
    • 064 - Children's Books
    • 063 - Wide for the Win
    • 062 - Point of View
    • 061 - Google Play
    • 060 - Mastering Action Sequences
    • 059 - Newsletter Swaps and StoryOrigin
    • 058 - Author Newsletters
    • 057 - The Pros and Cons of Pre-orders
    • 056 - Crowdfunding for Authors
    • 055 - Costs of Self-publishing a Book
    • 054 - Futurist Trends We Can Prepare for Now
    • 053 - Learn from TV and Movies
    • 052 - Building a Resilient Indy Business
    • 051 - Podcasting as Content Marketing
    • 050 - First Responders
    • 049 - Ruminations on Book Launches
    • 048 - Protagonist and Antagonist Voices
    • 047 - Backstory and Flashbacks
    • 046 - Writing Coroners
    • 045 - Exercise
    • 044 - Using Aggregators versus Direct
    • 043 - Killing Suspense
    • 042 - The Importance of Metadata
    • 041 - Writing Convincing Villains
    • 040 - Storytelling Lessons from Investigative Reporting
    • 039 Building a Writer Community
    • 038 - Graphic Novels
    • 037 - How Cozy is Cozy?
    • 036 - Frugal Tips for Writers
    • 035 - Police Procedures
    • 034 - Connecting through Video
    • 033 - Barriers to Creativity
    • 032 - Hybrid Publishing
    • 031 - ebook Pricing
    • 030 - Common Writer Wisdom: Is it Right for You?
    • 029 - Fostering Creativity through Digital Minimalism
    • 028 - Writing the Killer Query
    • 027 - Why to Stop Blogging
    • 026 - Weaving Your Day Job into Your Books
    • 025 - Mastering Book Descriptions
    • 024 - Three Hard Truths
    • 023 - Reaching New Readers through Translations
    • 022 - SEO for Authors
    • 021 - Building Communities in Podcasts and In Person
    • 020 - Working with Libraries & Bookstores
    • 019 - Judging a Book by Its Cover
    • 018 - The Importance of Masterworks
    • 017 - Story a Day
    • 016 - Drawing Back the Publishing Curtain
    • 015 - Five Things I Wish I Knew Before I Was Published
    • 014 - Collaborating on "Taking the Short Tack"
    • 013 - Writing in Time
    • 012 - Top Firearms Mistakes Writers Make ...
    • 011 - Making the Move to Full-Time Writer
    • 010 - Update from The Indy Author
    • 009 - Craft and Business of Short Fiction
    • 008 - Screenwriting
    • 007 - Faster Fiction
    • 006 - Importance of Storytelling
    • 005 - Image-intensive Books
    • 004 - Using Media Outlets
    • 003 - Small Press Publishing
    • 002 - Creativity Tips
    • 001 - Introducing The Indy Author
    • For Guests of The Indy Author Podcast
    • Podcast Guest and Topic Proposals
  • Services
    • Services - Author Consulting
    • Services - Podcasting for Authors
  • Podcasting for Authors
  • Short Fiction
  • Creating a Story Frame
  • Resources
  • Tools
  • Affiliates
  • The Craft
    • Getting Past the Fear of (First Draft) Commitment
    • Scalability
    • Professionalism
    • From Dead in the Water to Favorable Winds
  • The Voyage
    • Reading Your Work Aloud
    • Preparing to Request an Author Blurb
    • Navigating Indy
  • For the Armchair Sailor
  • Events
  • For Libraries
  • Blog
  • William Kingsfield Publishers
  • Patrons of The Indy Author
  • Press Kit
  • Enter